Menu
1 Corinthians 16:13 declares, Be on your guard; stand firm in the faith; be courageous; be strong. On today’s edition of Family Talk, with the election just a short time away, author Eric Metaxas implores Christians not to remain silent in the public square, especially when it comes to biblical issues. Noting the thousands of pastors who chose to remain neutral in Nazi Germany, Eric implores the Church to stand up to the face of evil today, lest we lose the country and freedoms that we hold dear.
To support this ministry financially, visit: https://www.oneplace.com/donate/707/29
Listen as Dr. James Dobson and Mary Crowley discuss the challenges women face, such as low self-esteem and the quest for self-fulfillment in a world full of distractions. Mary emphasizes the importance of confidence and a supportive community, sharing insights on finding personal success beyond societal norms. Through personal anecdotes and scripture-based wisdom, this episode aims to inspire women to discover God's plan for them and to thrive in every area of life.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh. And whether you're listening at home or on the go, you are in for something special today. We are bringing you a classic conversation featuring Mary Crowley, author of the book Women Who Win, Who We'll be right back. $400 million in business, powered by thousands of women working from their homes. The company became so successful that when they held a celebration, they filled an arena with 10,000 of their top saleswomen, and they featured Bob Hope and Billy Graham as special guests. But Mary's secret wasn't just business savvy. It was putting priorities in the right order. Mary started every company meeting by reading Scripture, often turning to the Proverbs for wisdom about leadership. And here's an interesting connection. Mary Kay Ash, who co-founded Mary Kay Cosmetics with a similar home party business model, was actually Mary Crowley's sister-in-law. Now, in her book, Women Who Win, Mary addresses a challenge many women still face today, and that is a lack of self-confidence. Her message is both simple and powerful. You are designed for fulfillment, and God has a plan for your life. Mary Crowley believed that by honoring God and serving others, women could find success both at home and in business. So let's listen now as Mary talks about those timeless principles with our own Dr. James Dobson on this special edition of Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
I would like to say this is one of the most generous women I have ever met. She supports Christian causes all across this country. And your generosity is legendary, Mary. So you have taken what God has given you and shared it with so many causes that you believe in. But where did all that start? How did you get into business?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I got in business 27 years ago. Actually, I'd been in direct selling business before that, but now my kids were grown and I saw a need. There was a need for American women to decorate their homes with excitement and with care. And from a coordinated line of accessories, I found that women were not sure what to do. And I'd worked for furniture companies before. And so we started the business to give women an opportunity to work from their homes, be there when the kids got home from school, and still use their creative genius, which God gave every woman. Every woman is a genius. Some just don't know it yet or haven't developed yet. And this is the idea of the business, and we had twin goals. One was to honor God, because I knew by then that if we didn't honor Him, we would not be successful. Now, that doesn't mean that people who do not belong to the Lord, and there are lots of successful people, quote, in the world, they can be successful. But if I've made a profession of faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and my Master, that I cannot be successful if I do not honor Him. Somehow along the line, he'll let me fall flat on my face. And I've done that a few times, too. I believe that's true. Absolutely. So it had to honor him. And then it had to bless and serve people. The whole world wants service. They can buy products. They can buy merchandise. They can buy lots of things. but we want genuine, caring, personal service. And that was our goal, to do that. And in so doing, to help the woman who was showing and selling our accessories to find fulfillment in herself and to have a fellowship of her sisters. You know, America needs places where people can go to belong, to find a support team. When our great-grandmothers came across the prairies, They had quilting bees and canning bees, and they had support teams for one another in their difficult times and in their joyous times. So we have built support teams all across America. And the fellowship is as important as the salesmanship. And so that's how we started. We started from our garage, very, very small. My son and my daughter and myself and a few friends, people that invested and believed in us. And it's grown beyond my wildest imagination, and it's pretty wild.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let's address some comments to the woman who is at home, where you were when you started. I don't know what your circumstances were, but let's suppose that she feels somewhat unfulfilled and somewhat frustrated. She wants to do something significant with her life. Maybe the kids now are in the teen years, and she knows they're going to be gone before too long, and she's wondering what now. What do you say to her? How does she begin to put it all together and find out who she is? Does that necessarily mean she's got to be successful in business like you are in order to find yourself?
SPEAKER 02 :
No. Again, I come back to the measure of success for each person. Success is a moving target. When you've got little kids at home, sometimes it's just getting through the day. You know, and then as they go into school and you begin to have other time, and then it may be reading good books and getting yourself, your mind activated again. Maybe it's starting an exercise program, whatever it is, that the measure of success that makes you feel fulfilled, it's different for everybody. And each person has to learn to define their own. Otherwise, they are always trying to
SPEAKER 03 :
Why do you think that moving target is so difficult for American women to hit? Why do you think so many American women are frustrated?
SPEAKER 02 :
Because they are trying to find their measure of fulfillment in what they're hearing, either on TV or maybe radio or reading in some magazine, instead of trying to find out what God's game plan is for them. I heard a wonderful interview with Walter Payton not long ago, and he defined something that was so great. The interviewer asked him, is your measure of success 100 yards gained in a game, as is the measure of success for a ball game for a running back? And he said, no, my measure of success is following the game plan consistently. designed for that game to the very best of my ability. And I thought that was a wonderful way to illustrate what everybody, God has a game plan for my life, for your life, for every woman out there with little kids or big kids or no kids. And if somebody tried to just copy mine, they might get very frustrated. I have a high energy level, and I can do a lot of things. Others might not. We're all made differently. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
Could it be that God's game plan for a particular woman would be to stay home and take care of three little kids under six years of age for this period of her life? Society is telling her that that's nobody's game plan. Could that be God's game plan for some people?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, he says that in his word, and then he also says that older women should help the younger women. And I think this is where, again, I was talking about a support team. A lot of young women with little children are feeling so alienated and so unsupported because maybe her parents or his parents do not live close. Society has not built a support team around them in our today's world. that's where they need to find a support team. They have to have fellowship with other women, and maybe it's a Bible class, maybe it's a home interior show, maybe it's coming in part-time, or maybe it's simply finding other group of women who have uplifting, motivating things to do. put in their hours otherwise sometimes we do recruit mothers with young kids because she's sitting there watching the daytime dramas and living in a fantasy world and that is no good for her and so if we can enlighten her and lift her up and give her something to do part-time that will fulfill her desires and create you know we try to develop her creative talents women want to be accepted understood and developed They don't want to stay static. They want to be developed. So whatever. If you're sitting out there and you're thinking, well, I'm not being developed, then you find something that develops your mind, your spirit, your being. And don't sit there and get caught in that daytime drama trap of fantasy world. That's the worst thing.
SPEAKER 03 :
You're talking about soap opera.
SPEAKER 02 :
I am, I am. Well, that's terrible.
SPEAKER 03 :
It really is.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, but that's what happens to a lot of women who are home with little kids, Dr. Dobson. That's what happens to them. And so then just being at home with the children does not minister to their spirit or does not even help them to be good mothers unless they must have a plan to be a successful mother and a successful wife and woman.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, what do you say to the person who is very frustrated in their present job? Do you have any advice to a person who just feels they're in a dead-end trap? Change it. Absolutely. But it costs money. I'm making more money than I could make someplace else. Yeah, but it's not making you happy, so what good is it? But I've got to feed my family.
SPEAKER 02 :
Find another way to feed them. No, it isn't really worth it if people are frustrated in their jobs unless there is a real way that they can change the frustration in that job. If it's their attitude, then they better change the attitude. But if it's the job itself and there is no hope of fulfillment, then change the job. Life's too short and too wonderful to waste it on frustration. Now, we'll have frustrations in all jobs. People need to realize that. There are days of frustration in any job, and you can't expect a frustration-free job. But at the end of the day, there must be something that you feel that you've accomplished in the lives of other people. or in going forward in your measure of success or something that you have done that is an accomplishment at the end of every day. Oh, there'll be days you think, well, what did I accomplish today? I've just not even gotten through the mail. I didn't get through the dishes. I didn't get through there too many. You know, we live in the day of distractomania. But you can find something, some life that you touched, something that you did that made the doing worthwhile.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think you've put your finger on really the critical issue having to do with the support team. I've tried to write and talk about that because I find many women know they need that but don't know how to go and get it. I was counseling with a young mother just the other day in my office, and she said, I don't have anybody. I don't have any close friends. The one I had turned her back on me. And this is a very bright woman who's a schoolteacher and is very capable, very verbal, very able to get out and meet the world. Oh, I need to recruit her. And yet I find many women like that don't know how to take the first step. There is a lack of confidence perhaps to go outside that front door and maybe somebody will hurt me or reject me and it's just easier or seems easier to pull in and let the four walls collapse. I guess you're really addressing that problem.
SPEAKER 02 :
We do. We address that problem a great deal. And you hit it when you said lack of confidence. One time I took a poll all across America from thousands of women, asked them what were their three greatest problems personality-wise, society-wise, business-wise, or family-wise. And north, south, east, and west, there was no names on the papers. It was lack of self-confidence, low esteem. I was just floored. Here's the greatest nation in the earth, the highest educational level for all women, the greatest opportunities. So I set about my goal is to help every woman I meet or that hear the sound of my voice to feel better about herself, to realize you are designed for life. God has a plan for your life, but I fully believe that they cannot find it till they find that absolute, till they realize that God is their creator, he is their maker, and then they begin to understand what is the character of God. He loves, he cares, he's just, he's fair, he has great things for us. And once you find that, you see, people often say to me, well, haven't you been discriminated against as a woman? Well, maybe I just didn't have sense enough to know it. But you see, if somebody tries to put me down, it diminishes them, not me. My self-worth is tied up in the character of God himself. And once any woman finds that out, she's redeemed. She's free to be herself and then free to have the confidence to say to somebody, look, I need some help. I want to get to know some people. And how do you turn people with low self-esteem into good salespeople? Well, first of all, they have to learn what selling really is. They have an idea that selling is going out and talking and convincing people. No, it is not. True selling is serving a need in that person. And women are very good at understanding that once you find what this person needs and help them fill the need. Women are in the habit of filling needs of children, of husbands, of You know, they're nurturers by very nature. And once they realize that it's a natural for them to be able to find the need and to fill it and to help the person in a serving way, they realize that it isn't something big out there that they have to learn, but it's something that they already have, a natural opportunity. ability to do. We just need to develop that ability and help them see what it really is. It's a matter of learning what selling really is. Most people think of it as something that you talk and that you convince. No, it's finding out person to person what her needs and desires and likes are, what she needs in her life, what she needs in her home, and then I can help you find that. I can help you Express your love for your family on the wall or in the figurines or the way that you even arrange a bouquet of flowers. And women are natural nurturers and natural helpers in this area. So once she finds out that she already has the natural ability, we just help her develop it.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, my book, What Wives Wish Their Husbands Knew About Women, is based on this same thing we're talking about here, where I ask over 10,000 women to rank order the sources of depression in their lives. And it blew me away, too, that the number one source of depression in young, middle-class, seemingly happily married Christian women was low self-esteem, 50%. of the original test group that I based this little study on put that number one, and 80% put it in the top five. So this pervasive lack of confidence, lack of self-worth, is extremely widespread in our culture. And I think, again, it comes back to television to some degree, where every woman feels like she's got to be beautiful and young and successful and the object of somebody's great romantic love and attention in order to feel acceptable and to feel the confidence necessary to cope with life. And unfortunately, that support system just often isn't there.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, and not everybody is young and slim and gorgeous.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, unfortunately. What do you do, Mary, when you're looking eye to eye with a very powerful male corporate executive who has the authority to move great numbers of people and so on? You being a woman, do you look eye to eye with him?
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, absolutely. Oh, I thoroughly enjoy him. I'm on lots of boards where I'm the only woman. But I don't come in and try to be a pushy female. Let me be sure that I do say that. I am there to make a contribution, not to compete. And with that complete positive attitude, I never have any difficulty there. Because God made us to have special roles and special talents and special abilities. And I can greet and meet and deal with people Corporate executives are presidents. Well, that's now.
SPEAKER 03 :
You've got 39,000 people on your staff. What about when you had one? What about when you were beginning? Did you have that kind of confidence, or did it grow through the years?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, part of it has grown through the years, but I always had a lot of confidence. Well, the good Lord born me on April Fool's Day. That was wonderful, because most people worry about making a fool of themselves, and they won't do things that are going to make a fool. I didn't have to worry about that. You'd already gotten the title. I'd already gotten the title, yeah. So... But part of it comes from the fact that, well, my grandparents taught me to... place the bible as one of you know our priorities not long ago i gave a speech to young people and i took a tv guide and a bible with me and i held them up i said all of you have these two books in your home which one do you refer to the most next week dr alan redpath from england recently spoke and he said in england we used to base our morality on the bible now we base it on tv And I thought, you know, that's exactly what's happening in America, really. And so in looking at the Bible, God is who he says he is in his book. I am who he says I am in his book. And since he's who he is and I'm who he says I am, I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.
SPEAKER 03 :
Who does he say you are, Mary?
SPEAKER 02 :
He says that I am a child of his. If I believe in Jesus Christ, I'm joint heirs with him. Wow! Wow! What kind of a promise that is. And then, oh, you know, many, many places he says, you talk about giving. Over in Thessalonians where he says, if you will give and share that all grace will be given in all situations and all your needs will be met. Now, that is a pretty powerful promise. And I've been claiming those for years. Tithing to me is the secret of it. You see, what I can make is not for me to be hoarding. It's a channel. It's a channel. It's kind of like forgiveness. Forgiveness is not given to us in a cup. It's given to us in a pipeline. So what I receive is to be given. You can't out-give God. He just multiplies it. I am just amazed at Him.
SPEAKER 03 :
What do you say to the people who just feel like they can't tithe? Mary, they just can't pay their bills now, and they are $75 short every week, and just isn't enough to go around, and the kids need shoes, and there's a hole in the roof, and we're trying to put our oldest boy into Christian schools. How in the world am I going to give any money to the Lord's kingdom?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I go back to when I started tithing, and it was about 40 years ago. And I was in just that same situation. I had two kids. I was a single parent. I was raising two kids. The war was on. I was working for an insurance company. My income had not risen like other people's had. It was pledge time at the First Baptist Church in Dallas, and I always pledged and gave, but I didn't think I could tithe. So, particularly night, though, the kids were asleep, and I was wrestling with that, and I was telling the Lord all the reasons I could not tithe. Hmm. And I thought of that verse in Proverbs, you know, but is the Lord convinced? He speaks to us through our creative genius mind that he gives us. Well, Mary, you're not doing such a hot job of it yourself. Why don't you give me a chance? I said, okay, Lord, I check tithe. It's your problem. It's your management of my life. I'm going to bed. So then I had to explain to our housekeeper and the kids, you know, we had to take it out first because if you don't take it out first, it won't be there. And we ate oatmeal quite a bit there in the beginning, and some of them would grumble and everything. Something happens. I can't explain it. I don't understand God's mathematics. But within two months' time, I was able to get out of debt. Behind the eight ball wasn't debt per se, but just get caught up. From that day till this, we didn't suddenly have a lot of money. But something did happen. And I can guarantee that if you give God's management of your money, he has management of your life. Things change. It really is true. I cannot explain it. It really is true. I challenge people. I've challenged. I teach classes. I told you of people, 150 people single by death or divorced. A lot of them have aging parents and a lot of problems. I challenge them every year. I say, okay, you tithe for six months. And at the end of six months, if you're not better off than you are now, I'll pick up the tab for the difference.
SPEAKER 03 :
You just said that to three million people.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's right. And I have never yet anybody take me up on it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jesus spoke more about money than any other subject. So it must be extremely important to our spiritual welfare as well as to our financial welfare.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, it's exciting.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, we have a great deal of love for you, as I've said, for the kind of person you are, what you represent, not what you give, but who you are. You love the Lord, and it shows in everything that you do. And it's been a pleasure meeting your staff. Some of your people came with you today, and they're sitting in the gallery over there watching us broadcast today. And I just hope that you'll come back, continue doing the great work that you're doing. And I just trust the Lord will be very close to you in this coming year.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you. It's been a joy to be here. And I guess I would like to say to every person out there, trust Him, try Him, prove Him. He will never let you down.
SPEAKER 03 :
You really mean that?
SPEAKER 02 :
I really mean that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Have you found that true of your entire lifetime?
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. See, I've learned that Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. And I can absolutely say, without any doubt at all, if you really trust Him... He has a better plan for your life than you can have for yourself. And I am amazed at what he's done with one little orphan gal.
SPEAKER 03 :
Bless you, Mary. Our prayers and our thoughts will be with you. Thank you.
SPEAKER 01 :
Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. What a great thought to wrap up today's classic program featuring the late Mary Crowley here on Family Talk. Now, you've been listening to Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk and a timeless conversation between Dr. Dobson and his guest, Mary Crowley, about finding purpose, building confidence, and trusting God's plan for your life. Mary's remarkable journey from a single mother to building a multi-million dollar business, all while putting God first, continues to inspire women even today. By the way, if you missed any part of this classic program, or if you'd like to share it with someone who really needs a word of encouragement today, visit drjamesdobson.org, or you can find the program easily on the Family Talk app. Here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, we are committed to helping you and your family grow closer to God and each other. But these daily broadcasts and resources are only made possible through the generous support of friends like you who share our vision for strong, faith-filled families. Your tax-deductible donation today will help us continue broadcasting messages of hope and practical wisdom to millions of listeners in America and all over the world. To make a secure donation online, go to drjamesdobson.org. Or if you prefer, you can send your donation through the mail. Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, P.O. Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. And for more daily inspiration and biblical guidance, I encourage you to explore our reading plans in the Bible app by YouVersion. You can choose from 48 different plans, 24 on marriage and 24 on parenting. Each one contains three lessons to encourage growth in your relationships. These brief devotionals are perfect for busy parents or couples who want to grow together in their faith. Just open the Bible app on your phone or mobile device, search for Dr. James Dobson, and start your first reading plan today. Well, I'm Roger Marsh and from all of us here at Family Talk, we are so grateful that you've joined us for today's classic program. Be sure to join us again next time for another edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
In this episode of Washington Watch, Tony Perkins dives into the recent aviation disaster in Washington, D.C., raising questions about air safety and military-civilian coordination. With insights from former President Donald Trump and newly confirmed Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy, the episode examines if the recent collision highlights broader flaws in airspace management. Additionally, the episode navigates the turbulent waters of political weaponization within the federal government, drawing on expert opinions from Congresswoman Harriet Hageman and others. We transition into global politics with a focus on South Korea, where President Moon Seok-yool's impeachment adds to concerns about democratic stability in the region. Senator Ted Cruz and Congresswoman Harriet Hageman provide commentary on the ongoing struggles against political weaponization. This episode is packed with expert insights and critical analysis on pressing national and international issues. Behind the scenes, the looming Super Bowl prompts discussion on the need for family-friendly entertainment standards following controversial performances in previous years. With a letter from Louisiana legislators prompting a commitment from the NFL, could this signal a shift in cultural values at major events?
SPEAKER 01 :
From the heart of our nation's capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and sound bites into conversations with our nation's leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview, Washington Watch with Tony Perkins starts now.
SPEAKER 15 :
We do not know what led to this crash, but we have some very strong opinions and ideas, and I think we'll probably state those opinions now. Because over the years, I've watched as things like this happen and they say, well, we're always investigating. And then the investigation three years later, they announce it. We think we have some pretty good ideas. But we'll find out how this disaster occurred and we'll ensure that nothing like this ever happens again.
SPEAKER 07 :
That was President Donald Trump earlier today responding to last night's tragic collision between an American Airlines passenger jet and the U.S. Army Black Hawk helicopter at Washington Reagan's National Airport. Welcome to Washington Watch, and thank you for joining us. Well, this morning, the rescue effort at the crash site shifted to a recovery mission after it was confirmed there were no survivors. Now the big question is, how did this happen?
SPEAKER 18 :
We are going to wait for all the information to come in from this vantage point, but to back up what the President said, what I've seen so far, do I think this was preventable? Absolutely.
SPEAKER 07 :
That was newly confirmed. Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy speaking earlier today. We'll get an update from Congressman Troy Nels of Texas. He's the chairman of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Subcommittee on Aviation. And for anyone who flies frequently in and out of Washington, it's obvious there are a lot of military helicopters in the air. But have they made the skies above D.C. too crowded? We'll discuss that with retired Air Force Brigadier General John Teichert later here on Washington Watch. Meanwhile, President Trump's nominee for FBI Director Kash Patel had his confirmation hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee today. The topic of government weaponization took center stage.
SPEAKER 08 :
And in many ways, the worst legacy, in my opinion, of the Biden administration. was the complete politicization and weaponization of both the Department of Justice and the FBI, turning them into tools to attack the perceived enemies of the Biden White House.
SPEAKER 07 :
That was Texas Senator Ted Cruz. We'll get reaction from Congresswoman Harriet Hageman of Wyoming, a member of the House Subcommittee on the Weaponization of the Federal Government. And amid ongoing news from the Middle East and the continuing war in Ukraine, there's been less focus on South Korea, where impeached President Moon Seok-yool faces charges of insurrection. Is South Korea's democracy at risk? We'll talk with Bruce Klingner, Senior Research Fellow at the Heritage Foundation and former CIA Deputy Division Chief for Korea. And finally, as I mentioned yesterday, there's some encouraging news regarding the content of the upcoming Super Bowl halftime show. Louisiana State Senator Valerie Hodges will join us later to share the details. All of that and more coming up on this Thursday edition of Washington Watch. Be sure and check out the website, TonyPerkins.com. Better yet, if you've not yet downloaded the Stand Firm app, I encourage you to go to the App Store and get the Stand Firm app so you can take Washington Watch with you wherever you go. Well, there was quite a bit of fireworks today during the confirmation hearing for three of President Trump's most, I'd say, controversial picks for key roles in his administration. Among the issues that came up during the hearing for Trump's nominee for FBI Director Kash Patel was the weaponization of the federal government, which Democrats claim is what President Trump is threatening to do. But as Republicans have rightly pointed out, weaponization is what we saw from the previous administration under Joe Biden. And President Trump has made clear that he will not be continuing a weaponized DOJ. Well, that message doesn't appear to be getting through to Democrats. Here now to discuss the issues, Congresswoman Harriet Hageman. She serves on the House Judiciary Committee and the Natural Resources Committee. She represents the at-large congressional district of the great state of Wyoming. Congresswoman, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always good to see you.
SPEAKER 02 :
Wonderful to see you, Tony.
SPEAKER 07 :
Before we get into the confirmation hearing and the president's executive order on the weaponization of government, I want to get your reaction to the tragic crash that took place in D.C. last night.
SPEAKER 02 :
It is absolutely heartbreaking. I flew out of DCA just a couple of hours before that to head home to Wyoming. One of the observations I had was looking out the window at the Potomac and thinking how absolutely frigid cold it looked with all the ice flows in it. And to hear about that last evening as I was driving from the Denver airport, again, it's just heartbreaking. My heart goes out to those families, to the teammates, to everyone who was affected by this terrible, terrible tragedy.
SPEAKER 07 :
I am pretty confident, as we've heard from the president, Sean Duffy, former colleague of yours, this is going to be thoroughly looked at. And I think it will be, given the fact that so many members of Congress fly in and out. And we've seen it. I mean, I'm flying it out every week. And you see the aircraft. It's a very crowded airspace. So I imagine that something is going to be done there. to deal with this. Let's talk about the weaponization. Let's first start. One of the first executive orders of President Trump was dealing with the issue of the weaponization of the federal government. Talk a little bit about that and how, given the position that you had on that weaponization committee, looking at all those issues, are we going to get a handle on this quickly?
SPEAKER 02 :
I've had a front row seat to see what happens when the federal government is weaponized against political opponents. We saw it play out in a couple of different ways under the Biden-Harris administration. One of them was the manner in which they charged and prosecuted the J6 folks, going after people who might have just simply walked through the Capitol, not even knowing that there were barricades up. and overcharging them dramatically. We know that because the Supreme Court has ruled in favor of many of the people who were charged, where the Biden-Harris administration was actually using a statute that was adopted to address the Enron situation of disposing of and destroying documents and records. And they used that as a way to try to enhance the sentences of the people on January—who were involved in anything associated with January 6. Then you contrast that with what happened in Portland, what happened in Minnesota during the summer of 2020, what happened in New York City. And the reason that I say you have to contrast it is, for one group of people that were disfavored by the Biden-Harris administration, they did everything they could to destroy them. For the people such as Antifa, the people who were involved in CHOP in Seattle and those kinds of things, they not only dropped charges or didn't bring charges in the first place, many of those people they settled with and paid them tens of thousands of dollars if they were at all inconvenienced at any time while they were burning down cities and causing billions of dollars of damage. If you look at what they did to President Trump, it's so clear in the cases in New York, Florida, and D.C. that the folks aligned with Biden and Harris and the Democrats, again, were using our justice system to go after a political opponent. As an attorney, as a long-term advocate for civil rights and civil liberties and adhering to our Constitution, I was pretty shocked to see how the government was weaponized as quickly as it was. When you look at the Russia, Russia, Russia collusion hoax and what the FBI did and their involvement and what the White House knew, in fact, they knew in August of 2016, before the 2016 election, that the Steele dossier was a hoax, that it was paid for by Hillary Clinton, that there was no validity to it. Yet they use the whole-of-government approach to get FISA warrants against the Trump team, to spy on them, to continue with an investigation against President Trump for a year-and-a-half under the auspices of claiming that he was conspiring with or colluding with the country of Russia to undermine America. I mean, all of these things together give you an idea of how weaponized the federal government became under the last administration.
SPEAKER 07 :
Congresswoman, I think it's been a process, because I think back into the 80s and 90s, where, even early turn of the century, where RICO statutes, which was, they were created back in the 1970s to go after the mob and racketeering, were used against pro-lifers. So I think, you know, those things were allowed to go forward, and I think it's kind of like the camel's nose under the tent. If you don't address it, it only gets worse.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's why I refer to what President Trump is doing as accountability. People want to say, well, he's going to weaponize this against his enemies, and Dick Durbin is saying that now. No, the people who engaged in this contact need to be held accountable for the decisions that they made. And so far, no one has been held accountable. One of the things that we did a lot of work on with the Select Committee on weaponization of the federal government related to the First Amendment and the mechanism that was used by Biden and Harris and their cohorts within that administration to stop us, the conservatives and Republicans, from being able to exercise their First Amendment rights. We know that from the Twitter files and the testimony of Matt Taibbi and Michael Schellenberger, what Professor Jonathan Turley has found. All of these things, all of these mechanisms by which the government was used to suppress the First Amendment rights, not only the freedom of speech, but as you point out, freedom of religion, using the FACE Act and literally turning it on its head and taking, you know, 72-year-old grandmothers who are praying outside of an abortion clinic and trying to throw them in prison for five years, not because that woman was any kind of a threat or violating anyone's civil rights, but for the purpose of making her as an example so that no one else would dare risk objecting to and fighting back against abortion. So that's what they did.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yes. And that's probably the most chilling aspect of this is that it was designed, it was to shock others into silence so that they would not speak or challenge these policies. And that's what happened with the J6 folks and what they endured. But the EO, the executive order, is great. I mean, you look at it, it addresses this issue, but it's an executive order. It can be repealed by the next administration. Congress has to deal with this. Are your colleagues ready to statutorily deal with this so that the government cannot be weaponized in the future against the American citizen?
SPEAKER 02 :
So a couple of things. In some ways, we already have. So being on the Judiciary Committee, part of our jurisdiction was revising Section 702 of the FISA warrants. And so after we learned what the FBI was doing in collusion with the Hillary campaign, in going after the Trump campaign during the 2016 cycle, we made fundamental changes to Section 702 of FISA that makes it much more difficult for the FBI to be using that process, at least to be weaponized against us. So we've already started that process. And I agree with you that this is an executive order. To the extent that any of these executive orders should be turned into statutes, we are already working through that process. so that we can be introducing them. But the other thing that I think is going to happen over the next four years, Tony, is that we're going to see so much exposed. And I think it happened over the last year and a half. I think that the reason that Donald Trump won with the resounding victory that he did was that people were horrified at what had happened with our legacy institutions, with those institutions that all of us grew up revering and thinking, hey, maybe I want to go and work for the FBI. What has been exposed over the last couple of years and what will continue to be exposed, number one, will help us to draft better legislation and make sure it doesn't happen again. But the other thing we need to do is just simply enforce the Constitution as written. I have an absolute First Amendment right in speech, in press, to peaceably assemble to petition my government for redress and to exercise my religion as I see fit. And one of the things that I have done is I have introduced a bill called the First Amendment Restoration Act. It is patterned after a similar federal law that applies to states. But basically what it says is that any federal employee who under color of federal law violates someone's First Amendment rights, they can be held liable in damages. We can get injunctive relief and we can also seek attorney's fees. So that's one of the bills that I actually worked with Jonathan Turley and some of my cohorts on the bill. Judiciary Committee, that we're going directly at these things, that it will be very clear that if you violate the First Amendment and you are a federal employee, I can sue you personally. So that's the kind of legislation we're pushing forward with.
SPEAKER 07 :
Harriet, I want to help you with that. We need that. We need accountability. That is a means of accountability. We're out of time, but always great to see you. Thank you so much for joining us today. And we look forward to working with you to protect that first freedom and to get rid of the weaponization of our federal government. All right, folks, we're going to look at South Korea next. The crisis there. Don't go away.
SPEAKER 17 :
During these challenging times for our nation, Family Research Council continues to serve as a watchman on the wall for faith, family and freedom. And together, thanks to your support, we're making an eternal impact. 2024 was a year of shining the light for biblical truth in Washington, D.C., Last fall, over 1,000 spiritually active, governance-engaged conservatives gathered for the Pray, Vote, Stand Summit to pray for our nation and ensure that the issues impacting sage cons were understood and advanced. Washington Watch with Tony Perkins marked a major milestone this year, its 900th episode, and added the Washington Watch News Desk, a new production that presents the top news each day from a biblical worldview. The Washington Stand published 2,000 articles of news, commentary, and podcasts in 2024, garnering over 5 million views. FRC's outlet for news and commentary continues to pursue the truth on the issues that matter most to you and your family. And with the launch of the Stand Firm app, you can listen to, watch, and read our content in one simple place. Pray for current issues, stay rooted in the scriptures, and engage the political sphere with the community of believers on our new platform. In 2024, FRC shaped public policy and culture, organizing the National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance where members of Congress and Christian leaders came together to seek God's intervention in America. In May, FRC called upon believers to pray for and stand with Israel by dedicating a portion of their worship services to pray for Israel's peace, prosperity, and protection. With Pray, Vote, Stand Decision 2024, FRC and Real Life Network led a powerful evening of election night coverage to analyze the election results and pray that our nation would turn back to God. We also filmed a transformative educational course, God and Government. Launching early this year in January 2025, this series will explore the biblical and historical foundations of our government, empowering you to stand confidently in your role as a citizen of heaven and earth. Family Research Council thanks you for partnering with us, and we look forward to 2025 and standing for faith, family, and freedom.
SPEAKER 03 :
Looking to grow closer to God in the new year? FRC's Stand on the Word spiral-bound journal is here to help. Dive deeper into scripture with thought-provoking questions, note-taking space, and context for each book and author. This second edition, covering Isaiah 2 Revelation, will guide you in tracking your journey through God's word while deepening your faith in Christ. Order now at frc.org slash store or text journal to 67742. Perfect for you and your loved ones.
SPEAKER 07 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Good to have you on this Thursday afternoon. The website, TonyPerkins.com, but better yet, get the Stand Firm app. And by the way, on the app, we have our first 100 Days Toolkit. That will enable you to engage in the process of helping correct some of the things that have happened in the last four years. There'll be action items. You'll have contact information for your member of Congress and your senators. You can find it, and it'll keep you up to date on what's happening. So you can get it on the app or just text the word TOOLKIT to 67742. That's TOOLKIT to 67742. All right. We're waiting for our guest. I've been tracking what's been happening in South Korea. South Korean President Eun Suk-yool shocked the world when he declared martial law in his country, a move widely condemned as an abuse of power. Now, that set off a political firestorm that has only grown more intense. Well, on Saturday, the impeached president was then indicted on charges of leading an insurrection. Now, A lot of stuff sounds very familiar, does it not? And this guy, he's kind of a conservative. And it's been the moderates, the liberals that have been opposing him in South Korea. Well, this ongoing political turmoil in South Korea has raised serious concerns about the stability of one of America's key allies. I mean, their democratic form of government is relatively new going back to the 1980s. And so it has some asking, can South Korea's democratic government And it's an important question because they're a stabilizing force there in that region of the world. All right, while we're waiting for a guest, I'm going to go to Meg Kilgannon, Senior Fellow for Education Studies here at the Family Research Council. She's been tracking a number of the confirmation hearings as we're watching these go through the process. And so I'm going to bring her in. Meg, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always great to see you.
SPEAKER 11 :
Great to be here, Tony.
SPEAKER 07 :
Let me continue my conversation I was having with Congresswoman Harriet Hageman regarding the – weaponization of government. Today, Kash Patel had his confirmation hearing in the Senate. This issue factored in very heavily, and Harriet made reference to this. This is what was brought up in the committee, that President Trump simply wants to weaponize government to be used against the left. How do we prevent this tit for tat, back and forth?
SPEAKER 11 :
Right. Well, I think that the problem with that analysis is that you're assuming that what happened the previous four years to former President Trump and people who had worked for him was not the weaponization of government. and that it was in fact perfectly legal behavior and something to be proud of, whereas we know that it was illegal behavior that has consequences. And so when you're enforcing consequences on people who've behaved badly, that doesn't mean you're weaponizing the government against them. It means that they are paying the price for the mistakes that were made. very grievous mistakes that have repercussions across the entirety of society. I mean, everything that was done to those folks that were serving in political power could be done to you or me.
SPEAKER 07 :
Right. But does it also kind of reveal with the Democrats the – They're kind of projecting. I mean, this is what they did when they had power. So they're just assuming that Donald Trump's going to do the same thing. Republicans will do the same thing. This is what they did.
SPEAKER 11 :
Right. I think you're seeing the trouble they're having sort of getting their foothold in this new paradigm since the big Republican win in November and this shock and awe campaign we're seeing from the White House and the executive branch. The Democrats are not responding, I think, very well. responding in their usual fashion, but it's not meeting the moment, right? People see through this now.
SPEAKER 07 :
So we're going to see a course correction. I mean, we've already seen the president in his executive order on January the 20th regarding the weaponization of federal government, the personnel that he is appointing. But how can the people that were targeted by the DOJ under the Biden administration and the victims of the weaponization of the federal government, how can they be made whole?
SPEAKER 11 :
Right. This age old question, where do I go to get my good name back? Right. It's it's there. These are these are crimes against people that are hard to to to really make right. And so I think maybe that is part of the reason why the other side is so focused on it. They understand on a primal level the grievous wrongs that were done, and they're probably operating out of a sense of fear that they will be held accountable for what they did.
SPEAKER 07 :
Meg, we've got our guest now to talk about South Korea. So unless you want to talk about South Korea, I'll let you.
SPEAKER 11 :
I can't wait to hear the guest.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah. All right. Meg Kilgannon, thanks so much for joining us. All right. Do we have him now? Okay. All right. So we don't have it. Okay. All right. This is the joys of live programming. So we're going to see if we can get connected with him. There's some issues there with our connections. But again, let me jump back here to South Korea. When we look at the parallels, we talked about this a while back when this was first unfolding, but it's continued. And we need to be aware, especially when you look at South Korea's spiritual history and the vibrancy of the church and what's been happening over there, and then all of a sudden it just began to implode. And The conservative, progressive, liberal, whatever you want to call it, leftist, have been fighting and taking their fragile democratic government really to the edge. And so anyway, it's something I think we need to keep an eye on while we're looking at domestic issues, looking at issues in the Middle East and elsewhere. All right. We're almost out of time in this segment. And when we come back, we're going to talk about some good news. All right. You want some good news? Good news is that the NFL is responding to a group of pro-family leaders and legislators from the state of Louisiana regarding the halftime show in the upcoming Super Bowl. So we're going to be joined by state senator, Louisiana State Senator Valerie Hodges next, to share their response to this letter and a commitment. We'll see if they hold to that commitment. But nonetheless, they're listening. We could be in a moment of sea change where we see a lot of things shifting. All right, don't go away. We're back with more Washington Watch after this.
SPEAKER 06 :
Have you ever been to the Museum of the Bible in Washington, D.C.? Well, now you have a special reason to be there on Wednesday, February 5th. First, you can take part in the third annual National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance. God's ways are higher than our ways. The Lord clearly reveals in Scripture any nation that genuinely worships Him is a nation with leaders willing to repent and ask forgiveness for sins. The NGPR is a unique public gathering where scores of congressional leaders, including Speaker Mike Johnson, join with international leaders representing more than 50 nations for one sole purpose.
SPEAKER 12 :
Forgive our nations against you and you alone have we sinned.
SPEAKER 06 :
You can be there in the room to pray along with members of Congress, dignitaries from other nations, and Christian leaders from across the U.S. The NGPR is hosted by Family Research Council President Tony Perkins and Dr. Jim Garlow, founder of Well-Versed World, along with Rabbi Jonathan Cahn and former Congresswoman Michelle Buchman. Right after the prayer and repentance gathering, participants will move to the World Stage Theater for a private update on important events happening in Israel. and watch a preview of the historic new documentary on the Megiddo Mosaic, the most remarkable archeological find in Israel since the Dead Sea Scrolls. This is truly one of a kind opportunity to learn what's going on behind the scenes in Israel and how it could affect the whole world. Both of these Bible honoring events require tickets. Go to PrayDC.org, register today to attend in person on February 5th. As a bonus, your ticket grants you a free admission to experience the rest of the Museum of the Bible. Seating is limited for both events. Go to PrayDC.org to get tickets today.
SPEAKER 07 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Good to have you with us on this Thursday. Well, in just 10 days, the Super Bowl will be in New Orleans. And this year, there's some good news for families across the country. After concerns were raised over past halftime performances featuring explicit content, event organizers have confirmed that the Super Bowl, Super Bowl 59, their halftime show will be a family-friendly event. So will this be the year that families won't have to switch the channel when it's halftime? Could this be a pivotal point going forward for the Super Bowl? Joining me now to discuss this, Louisiana State Senator Valerie Hodges, who led Louisiana lawmakers and pro-family groups in addressing this issue to get this commitment. Senator Hodges, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 13 :
Thank you for having me, Tony. I appreciate it.
SPEAKER 07 :
All right. So it's always good to have some good news. Tell us about the response that you received to the letter.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, we got a I didn't know whether to really expect a response or not. We sent the letter on the 16th and all the press releases went out on Monday and they were very quick to respond. After that, we got a letter from Jay Cicero saying, who is the CEO of the Greater New Orleans Sports Foundation. And he issued a statement in response to the letter that I was very, very excited about and impressed by. And I don't know if you want to read the response, but I have it in front of me. No, go ahead and read it, Valerie. Okay, it says, he wrote, we respect and value the comments of our legislators who play a critical role in our ability to secure large events, providing an economic boost to our city and our state, Cicero said. We have shared the letter with the NFL, and we are all in agreement that this year's halftime show will be a family-friendly event befitting New Orleans' storied history hosting Super Bowls. And I was very, very pleased with that. He recognizes that the legislature does contribute greatly to this event and that we're all excited about the event being here in Louisiana and that it should be a family-friendly event. And he agreed that the NFL would do something about it. So we'll see.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, I know it's a trust but verify as we look at this. But it's encouraging that they responded to it. There's recognition there's a problem. They're now on the record saying that we want to see this as well. And, of course, we also know I've been in touch with the the head of the Louisiana State Police, as well as the attorney general in Louisiana. And they are going to be watching a lot of the, whether or not laws are violated. They're also going to be addressing the issue that you and I talked about earlier in the week, and that was the issue of human trafficking, which is at its peak around such events as the Super Bowl.
SPEAKER 13 :
Correct. And I thought... the quote that was released was through the Louisiana Illuminator. And I posted the response from Mr. Cicero and the link to the article from the Louisiana Illuminator on my Facebook. It's Valerie Hodges State Senate page. And I want to ask your listeners to go to that and look at it, read the letter, read the response. And the article was really a good article. And they even referenced at the end the fact that the NFL and Roger Goodell still, They signed a contract last year with, I think, I don't remember, J.C., J.Z., that was accused of rape. And I don't know where that court case is. But these are not issues that we can any longer ignore. We've seen the issues that are going on across the nation with the... with P. Diddy, I'll just say it. And so this is not appropriate behavior, and it's certainly not appropriate behavior at one of the largest sports venues in the nation of the year. And so that's what we're hoping, that they will take the letter into account and make some changes. And that's all we're asking is family-appropriate halftime shows.
SPEAKER 07 :
Right. I mean, everybody's watching a sports event, and next thing you know, you've got a script show. The good thing about this, you pointed out, when you look at everything that's happening across the country, is that you have... Corporate America is taking note of the last election. They've been taking note of the grassroots efforts pushing back against their woke DEI policies. And so I think sports is not immune from that. They've been bitten by that as well. And I think when you look at this in context... It was a great time to weigh in and ask for them to clean up their act because I think that's the moment we are in. So hopefully this will not just be for this Super Bowl, but maybe we change and raise the standard going forward.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, I believe that, Tony, and it's time for our voices to be heard. And they've been, a few have spoken up, I think, even though, so many people told me, I'll never watch the halftime shows. I'm not even going to watch the Super Bowl anymore. Well, that affects their advertisers. The advertisements, the... the ads are great, that they spend a lot of money. But then when people turn off the television or they switch the channel, that's hurting their viewers, their viewership and the advertiser. So I'm hoping they take this into account. This is not a small handful of people. Everywhere I go in the last this last week, people have come up to me, gone out of their way to thank me for the letter and say because they said, thank goodness somebody is saying what we all feel. And there's And that's the thing, that when you have got 18 legislators, you have got national groups like your group, other groups, statewide groups, local groups, this is a large majority of people who are expressing the same thing. And, hopefully, they are listening, according to what Mr. Cicero said, and that they have agreed to make it family-friendly. And this is what America wants. This is who we are. We are people of dignity. And I believe we have moral values. And there are places to go if you want to see a strip show or pole dancing. But the Super Bowl is not the place to do that.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, let's play football. All right, Valerie Hodges, thanks for joining us. Great to see you. Good work.
SPEAKER 13 :
Good to see you, too.
SPEAKER 07 :
All right, folks, coming up next, we'll discuss the latest developments following the Reagan Airport disaster last night. So stay tuned. Don't go anywhere.
SPEAKER 04 :
As President-elect Donald Trump's second inauguration approached, a powerful prayer gathering took place in Washington, D.C., drawing Christians together to intercede for our nation.
SPEAKER 07 :
The church does not recapture its prophetic zeal. It will become an irrelevant social club without moral or spiritual authority. God help us to recapture that prophetic zeal.
SPEAKER 10 :
This is not an interreligious service. We will not be praying to Allah or Buddha. We'll be praying to the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. We're talking to God, a holy, righteous, just God from a nation that desperately needs the touch of this God.
SPEAKER 09 :
We've not been a secular nation. We don't want to be a secular nation. We've been a nation built around God, and our history shows that.
SPEAKER 04 :
The well-versed and family research council led the inauguration praise and prayer convocation, urging attendees to pray for the incoming presidential administration and for the church to embody holiness and righteousness, champion biblical justice, and proclaim truth prophetically.
SPEAKER 07 :
Lord, may this not be the end, but may this be the beginning, this convocation, this gathering. And may we commit to pray and to seek you and to walk in your word and in your ways. In Jesus' name, amen. Hello, I'm Tony Perkins, president of Family Research Council here in Washington, D.C. Behind me is one of the most recognizable buildings in all the world, the U.S. Capitol. What does it stand for? Well, most people say government. But you know, the Bible talks about four institutions of government. You know what they are? And do we have a republic or a democracy? Well, what do you say? Also, what about this saying separation of church and state? Does that mean Christians shouldn't be involved in government? Guess what? We address those issues and more in our new God and Government course. I invite you to join us to see what the historical record and the Bible has to say about government. Join us for God and Government.
SPEAKER 05 :
Download the new Stand Firm app for Apple and Android phones today and join a wonderful community of fellow believers. We've created a special place for you to access news from a biblical perspective, read and listen to daily devotionals, pray for current events and more. Share the Stand Firm app with your friends, family and church members and stand firm everywhere you go.
SPEAKER 07 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us. Be sure and get your first 100-day toolkit. You can get it by texting TOOLKIT to 67742. Our word for today comes from Jeremiah chapter four, where Jeremiah reflects upon the prophetic message he has received. Oh my soul, my soul, I am pained in my very heart. My heart makes a noise in me. I cannot hold my peace because you have heard, oh my soul, the sound of the trumpet, the alarm of war. Destruction upon destruction is cried for the whole land is plundered. Suddenly my tents are plundered and my curtain in a moment. As followers of Christ, if we are following him and we are in his word, we will see the words of warning from the Lord unfolding right before our eyes. It is a burden to see and it should grieve us to see the steady drumbeat of our nation marching toward destruction because of our rejection of God and his word. Understand the reality of hell as the coming judgment for all who do not repent. We should be motivated to issue the same warnings as Jeremiah with passion. Repent and return to the Lord. To find out more about our journey through the Bible, text Bible to 67742. That's Bible to 67742. Recovery operations are underway now following last night's mid-air collision between an Army helicopter and an American Airlines flight from Kansas, which killed all 67 people aboard both aircrafts. At least 28 bodies, including all three soldiers who were on the helicopter, had been recovered from the icy waters of the Potomac River near D.C. when the collision took place last night at 8.48 p.m. Eastern. Now, many right now are searching for answers in what do we know so far and what steps can be taken to prevent something like this from occurring again. Joining me now to discuss this, Congressman Troy Nels, who serves on the Judiciary Committee as well as the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure, where he is the chairman of the Subcommittee on Aviation. He represents the 22nd District of Texas. Congressman Nels, welcome to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 14 :
Thank you, Tony. Good to be with you.
SPEAKER 07 :
All right. So what's the latest? What do we know regarding this incident that occurred last night?
SPEAKER 14 :
Well, we know that there are still recovery operations continuing. You know, you had 67 lives lost, and we need to make sure that we can account for each and every one of those individuals. We know that the NTSB, they've been on the ground within a few hours of this taking place last night. I believe they're up to almost 44 people or so from the NTSB is assisting first responders and others, but they will also be the lead investigative group in this crash. So we know that there are dive teams there. The FBI has sent their response team. There are dive teams there trying to recover the black boxes You know, there's two black boxes on that aircraft. There's the data recorder and then there's the cockpit voice recorder trying to get those two black boxes recovered. And I know that the NTSB has received what they'll call like a full package, a full ATC package, which is the air traffic controller. So all the communications prior to the crash and moments after the crash are all in the hands of the NTSB, and they'll be doing their investigation. I had a briefing with them, and Chairman Graves, he's the chairman of the full Transportation and Infrastructure Committee. We had a briefing with NTSB a few hours ago, and they informed us on the most current information, and it's just, you know, very, very sad. when you see what took place. And now the real question is, you know, the NTSB report, how long will it take for them to, you know, to conduct an investigation and what kind of findings will there be. But I just, I encourage the NTSB and FAA to make sure that, you know, they have accurate information. It's all factual. And then we will look at that information and see if it leads to any type of recommendation. But that's what we have up to this point.
SPEAKER 07 :
It's been nearly two decades since we've had an air disaster such as this right here in our nation's capital. I would assume, being that so many in Congress are flying that same route, each week. And the skies in D.C. have become more crowded. We're seeing a lot of military aircraft, a lot of commercial aircraft. I would think all of those things are going to be looked at by members of Congress because they want to make sure that this is, in fact, made safe again.
SPEAKER 14 :
Sure. I do it every week. I fly out of Houston, Intercontinental, and I got a direct flight right into D.C.A., so I'm very familiar. with that route. They're very familiar with that airport. And so we'll have to wait. A lot of people coming up with their own opinions as to whose fault, pointing fingers, this and that. I think that's, I want to just say, maybe a little irresponsible at this time. We have to give the NTSB an opportunity to look at everything, come up with a report. And And speaking to them earlier today, they stated they could have a preliminary report, possibly within 30 days. So I think that's a step in the right direction. I don't want to see something like this be drug out where we don't know anything for 18 months, because I don't think President Trump is going to want that. He's going to want a very thorough, deliberate investigation into this. I believe that President Trump would want to have some answers and then to try to rectify any type of issues going forward to make sure something like this never happens again.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, I would imagine that he's going to be pushing for that report very, very soon. Congressman Troy Nels, thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate you joining us by phone. Great to talk with you.
SPEAKER 14 :
Thank you. God bless you.
SPEAKER 07 :
All right. Congressman Troy Nels of Texas, 22nd District. And I want to continue this discussion on last night's tragedy that took place. As Troy was saying, he flies it. I fly it every week almost as well. Same route as I fly from my home state of Louisiana into D.C. And, you know, you can't help but see the military aircraft that's around. There's a lot of it. It's also just the slightest weather issue backs up the traffic because it is so heavy coming into Reagan National. So what do we need to be looking at here? And if you look at some of the video, it looked very odd from the helicopter that collided with the jet. Joining me now to discuss this, retired Air Force Brigadier General John Teichert. He was a former command pilot with more than 2,000 hours and 38 different aircrafts. As a distinguished military career, General Teichert retired as the Assistant Deputy Undersecretary of the Air Force for International Affairs. General, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, thanks for having me.
SPEAKER 07 :
So what can, I know you've been discussing this with others, your contacts. What can you tell us that you have learned so far from last night's crash?
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, very clearly there was a breakdown in deconfliction between the airliner and the helicopter. And normally when that happens, it's due to some sort of confusion or breakdown in communication. And as these mishap investigation boards stand up, one from the NTSB, one from the Army, They're going to be gathering the information. Part of that will be collecting the full tapes of the air traffic control transmissions over the course of that flight. And then those black boxes, or flight data recorders, are going to have information about what was being discussed within both of those cockpits. And I think the breakdown and deconfliction is going to tend back to a root cause of confusion or lack of communication that those pieces of evidence will help sort to reveal.
SPEAKER 07 :
JOHN YANG What do we know about the Black Hawk helicopter? What was its mission? What was it doing?
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, any helicopter pilot that flies within the D.C. area has special training and qualifications because it is such a congested and highly prescripted area based on national security concerns. But any helicopter that flies is either performing or training to perform one of three primary missions, distinguished visitor transport. protecting Washington, D.C., from the air or responding to a national emergency. In this particular case, the Black Hawk crew was training for one of those mission sets. And in order to train, you need to fly in the airspace in a realistic way. And that's what they were doing last night.
SPEAKER 07 :
Have you seen the video that was caught that you just see the lights? It was a clear night, as the president pointed out, that you can see. And it just appears that the helicopter just flew right into the airplane. It is.
SPEAKER 16 :
That aircraft was on a very predictable, slow and vulnerable part of its approach from the south to the north at DCA. And clearly that helicopter, for whatever reason, did not see that aircraft, was not provided deconfliction help by air traffic control. And you're right. You see a very fast vector from the left to the right that slams the helicopter into the aircraft that initiated this tragedy.
SPEAKER 07 :
Have the skies over our nation's capital become too congested?
SPEAKER 16 :
It is worth the discussion, Tony. And several legislatures have had this discussion already as the number of flights out of DCA grows. And you think about those number of flights and then all of the helicopter traffic that is only there for first response law enforcement or military purposes. But it is such a tight area of airspace because of the population and the limits based on national security that it is worth having a full discussion about whether there is too much traffic in and out of DCA and to reassess the processes, procedures and techniques of military and law enforcement aircraft to make sure that there's no unnecessary missions going on in that airspace.
SPEAKER 07 :
So, General, as you point out, the three reasons for them to be flying missions there are, We've seen an increase in the commercial air traffic because every time the FAA is reauthorized, we see more slots created for D.C. because it makes it convenient for those of us who fly into D.C., for members of Congress. But also, we live in a different time. Increasingly, the security threats to our nation's capital have increased. So is that also a part of... creating a greater need for those assets to be in the air in our nation's capital.
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, part of the answer is yes. But we have two very capable airports in the D.C. area, one up in Maryland, BWI, one out at Dulles, that could handle some of this traffic. And we need to be careful that we're not trading in convenience and creating risk like seemingly happened last night. And, you know, the investigators First, we will preserve perishable evidence. Second, they will figure out what happened. But, most importantly, they will get to the root cause of why it happened, so that we can update procedures, policies, techniques and airspace, so that nothing like this happens again. That's their primary charge. And I think part of that assessment is going to be air traffic control and the amount of volume of traffic both at DCA and those other missions around the D.C. area.
SPEAKER 07 :
Now, I know no one wants to jump to conclusions on this because there is an investigation, and I'm sure it will be thorough. Again, I think this will be investigated very, very closely because it is in our nation's capital, and so many members of Congress are directly touched by this. But some have said, and there's certainly reason and justification to say it, that when you look at both the commercial, the FAA, and you look at the military, there's been such a misplaced focus on non-essential services. skill sets, DEI, that it could distract from the necessary training that is needed to make people proficient in their jobs. Is that justified?
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, I have seen some of that distraction in the DOD during the last four years. And we see now a president and a secretary of defense who are insisting that we get back to a constitutionally grounded, mission-focused, merit-based system within the national security sphere. And we heard some of that from the president about air traffic controllers as well. And we think about how diversity has been elevated during the last four years to the sacrifice of unity and shared purpose. And I have seen many in the military who have lamented the fact that we have drifted away from the focus that the military is there to be lethal and ready because of all these other distractive elements. And now it is very welcome amongst the vast majority of the military members to get back to a focus on the mission and a focus back on merit-based elevation.
SPEAKER 07 :
General Teichert, it's sad that it requires a tragedy to bring us back to focus on what is essential. I mean, I can cite several recent examples going back to July of this last year, President Trump nearly then died. former President Trump, nearly assassinated because there was issues in the Secret Service. We're looking at California that's been on fire because their fire department looked at DEI as opposed to fighting fires. And now we see, and I hope it's not the case, but there's enough to point to it that that's probably a contributing factor to what happened last night.
SPEAKER 16 :
Tony, I think you're right. And I think the breakdown in law enforcement in New Orleans over New Year's is one of those same types of situations where when you focus on things other than the mission, then you're naturally going to have the opportunity cost where you are less professional, less capable and less able to handle the situations that are demanded by the mission. And we see it in a variety of areas in our country. And I really do hope, whether you take that away from this accident or not, that we recognize that institutions are there to accomplish a mission. And when you don't focus on that mission, then there are harms that will result from the distraction that is a part of those lack of focus and lack of unity.
SPEAKER 07 :
It unfortunately is the reality. It just is. General Teichert, I want to thank you for joining us and appreciate your insights on this.
SPEAKER 16 :
Thanks as always, Tony.
SPEAKER 07 :
And folks, that's another matter of prayer. We just need to be praying that our nation would move back to operating in truth, common sense, constitution, truth, so that the mission of our government becomes its focus, its real mission is its mission. Right, out of time for today. Thanks for joining us. Until next time, I leave you once again with the encouraging words of the Apostle Paul found in Ephesians 6, where he says, when you've done everything you can do, when you've prayed, when you've prepared, and when you've taken your stand, by all means, keep standing.
SPEAKER 01 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council and is entirely listener supported. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information on anything you heard today or to find out how you can partner with us in our ongoing efforts to promote faith, family and freedom, visit TonyPerkins.com.
In this inspiring episode, Dr. Dobson and Dr. Hawkins discuss The Nehemiah Code, emphasizing its message that it’s never too late for a new beginning. Explore how Nehemiah's biblical account can inform our approach to leadership, teamwork, and personal growth today. Listen as they highlight the importance of building strong foundations and fostering community to overcome life's obstacles.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, hello everyone. I'm James Dobson and you're listening to Family Talk, a listener-supported ministry. In fact, thank you so much for being part of that support for James Dobson Family Institute.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome back to Family Talk. I'm Roger Marsh, and on today's program, we're going to hear part two of a fascinating conversation featuring Dr. Dobson and his guest, Dr. O.S. Hawkins, former pastor of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, and president emeritus of Guidestone Financial Resources. On our last broadcast, Dr. Hawkins shared about his ministry helping retired pastors through Mission Dignity, and he introduced his popular series of code books that help believers dive deeper into Scripture. Today, he'll take us into the powerful story of Nehemiah, showing us how this ancient tale of rebuilding Jerusalem's walls offers practical wisdom for anyone seeking a fresh start in life. Now, these insights come from Dr. Hawkins' book, The Nehemiah Code. It's never too late for a new beginning. Through the story of Nehemiah, we'll discover timeless principles for starting fresh. whether we're rebuilding relationships, restoring faith, or seeking a new direction in life. Dr. Hawkins will remind us that with God's help, genuine transformation is always possible. And now let's rejoin Dr. James Dobson for part two of this inspiring conversation here on Family Talk.
SPEAKER 02 :
Dr. Hawkins, thank you so much for being with us again today. I love the program we did together last time. And we've got a lot more to talk about related to your book, The Nehemiah Code. It's never too late for a new beginning. And what I... love about this book is that I really love the story of Nehemiah. But I want to take that story back before you start with the book to how we pick up Nehemiah in Babylon. He was a cupbearer for the king, wasn't he?
SPEAKER 03 :
To King Artaxerxes, yes. And the beautiful thing about Nehemiah, what I like to remind people is he wasn't a preacher. He wasn't a prophet. He wasn't a theologian. He was not a theologian. He was a civil servant. He had a civil service job as cupbearer to Artaxerxes with all the fringe benefits, retirement benefits, everything, and he left it all to be the rebuilder of the broken walls. You know, after the death of King Solomon, as you know, the kingdom of Israel divided into a northern kingdom and a southern kingdom. In the northern kingdom, They were ruled by all wicked kings. There wasn't one good king among them. And in 722, the Assyrians took them away into captivity, and they never returned. The southern kingdom— Did Nebuchadnezzar's army do that? No, that was the Assyrians in 722. In 586, then, to the southern kingdom, Nebuchadnezzar came and besieged Jerusalem. in a horrible siege, and they destroyed the city, broke the walls down, burned the gates, and they took the brightest Jewish minds they could find back to Babylon.
SPEAKER 02 :
Daniel was one of them.
SPEAKER 03 :
Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and others. And they took them back to re-educate them. They tried to change their language. They tried to change their literature. All those things you can read about in the book of Daniel. And so after a period, the Persians broke the Babylonian supremacy. A remnant had returned to Jerusalem to rebuild the walls, and they got so discouraged that they quit. And Nehemiah heard a report that Jerusalem was a reproach, and the walls were still broken, the gates burned. And he went to the king and begged permission to go back to Jerusalem, and he was granted. And Nehemiah went back to Jerusalem. He made a midnight ride on a horse around the walls, and he wept over the ruins. He did. And he began fasting. He fasted and prayed before the God of heaven, the Bible says. And then he moved and mobilized that remnant that was there that for years had left that city dormant. And in 52 days, they rebuilt the city. And there's some incredible evidence. applications there to how any of us, whoever we are, whatever our circumstance, can rebuild our own broken lives. Because as the subtitle of the book says, and the message of Nehemiah is this, it's never too late for a new beginning.
SPEAKER 02 :
And that's exactly what he did and began building the wall. And it wasn't that he didn't have opposition. Sanballat, as I recall, was out on the edge of town, and he was making fun of him.
SPEAKER 03 :
He said if a fox runs up on it, it'll fall down. Sanballat and Tobias and others, he faced incredible opposition. But he kept focused. He kept going forward. The book is divided into several sections of what you need to do to be a rebuilder. First of all, you've got to get started right. And that's what Nehemiah did. Rebuilders get started right. They make an honest evaluation of the situation. They identify with the need. They take personal responsibility. And then they move out of their comfort zones. You know, we live today in comfort zones. Some of us don't have anything to do with anybody unless they're in our socioeconomic level. or political level, or whatever, educational level. So he got started right. Then the second thing he did, he built a team spirit. And that is so vital in rebuilding. He was a great organizer, wasn't he? He was a credible organizer. And if I had a pencil in my hand right now, a wooden pencil, I could easily break it. But if I put two or three together, it's exponentially more difficult to break. We call that synergy. That's what he did. You know, the Bible says if one can chase 1,000, two can chase 10,000. He understood and recognized that we all need each other in the rebuilding process. So he built this team spirit of those around him. He started with his goal in mind, seized his opportunities, and motivated his people to get off a dead center. One of the most important things he did, he was an example himself. You know, the greatest leadership principle I know in or outside the Bible, and there are millions of leadership books, I suppose. But Gideon, in Judges 7-7, he got his army down to 300 people, as you remember, and was going out to fight thousands of the Midianite host with that little army. And the last thing he said to them, he turned to them in Judges 7-7 and said, do as I do. It's the greatest principle of leadership, I know, because eventually, those of us in leadership, the people on our team are going to do what we do. And so this was one of the real secrets of Nehemiah. He was there with them. He was putting those stones in with them. He was building. He was up and down the lines, showing them appreciation. One of the greatest motivating factors in the rebuilding process is to give people a pat on the back. To say they're appreciated. Let them know that they're appreciated. This is what Jesus did. He went around.
SPEAKER 02 :
And do as I do.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, and do as I do. This is what Jesus did. He went around affirming people. Affirmation is vitally important.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, a related passage in Scripture. related to Nehemiah is found in the book of Ezra. And Ezra was a priest. And they got in there. This is a wonderful passage. I think it's in the 10th chapter of Ezra. And Nehemiah had to be close at hand. And they got into the ruins of of Jerusalem and came across the scrolls, and they began reading them, and their eyes were opened to their sin, and they were marrying foreign wives and so on. And there was a platform there, and Ezra got up on that platform. and began reading the scrolls.
SPEAKER 03 :
Just read the Word of God.
SPEAKER 02 :
And their eyes popped open, and they began weeping. If there's a moment in Scripture, or one of them, that I would most like to have been there, is to be there when this repentance, this revival broke out through the people. And they say, we sinned against the God of heaven. And they fell on their faces, and Nehemiah was weeping. And that was the beginning of the energy that helped to rebuild the wall, wasn't it?
SPEAKER 03 :
And as the Bible says, it's not my word, God said, like a hammer that breaks a rock to pieces. And when the word of God goes forth, not just in Ezra and Nehemiah's day, but in our day, When we get the word of God into our heart, it makes a huge difference.
SPEAKER 02 :
Don't you wish that spirit would spring across this country and that people would say, oh, I didn't know that was in the Bible. I didn't know what I was doing. Was that wrong? We have sinned against God. Forgive us, Lord. We repent of our sin.
SPEAKER 03 :
Exactly. And that's really the motivating factor that I have behind all these code books, because every one of them go to the Scripture, because it's the Bible. It's the Scripture that brings conviction. You know, there's a lost word in our Christian vocabulary, conviction. When Peter stood up and read from Joel and illustrated it with some Psalms on the day of Pentecost and preached that great Pentecostal proclamation, do you remember what it says? It says their hearts were cut. They fell under deep conviction, and that only comes from the Word of God. You know, another thing about Nehemiah was how he dealt with, I call it, rebuilders never cut what they can untie.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, I read that, and that didn't ring true to me. I didn't know what you meant by that, but now I do. Explain it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you were a little boy in Fort Worth, and so was I. And in my block over on the east side of Fort Worth, there was an old vacant lot on that block. And that was our ball fit. It was like Yankee Stadium to me and my buddies on Crenshaw Street. And we'd play ball up there. And there was one kid that would come to that vacant lot. And he would always have – he had a pair of black canvas high-top tennis shoes. This was back in the 50s when I was a boy. And those shoes would only be laced up halfway up to the top. And there'd be several eyelets at the top unlaced because he was so impatient that when he would get a knot in his shoelaces, instead of taking the time to untie them, he'd take his pocket knife out and just cut them off. And that's the way a lot of people do in relationships. They don't want to take the time and the effort and the energy to untie those knots that get into a relationship. So they just come along. And for some people, it's easier just to cut them off. And that's why they go from one relationship to another, to another, to another. But when you're rebuilding relationships, You never cut what you can untie. Conflict resolution is a vital important of Nehemiah's story because conflict will tear your team apart. It doesn't matter whether it's at church or at home or in business or wherever. And so Nehemiah, there were four things he did to resolve conflicts. And timing was everything. He said there's a time to back off. There's a time to stand up. There's a time to give in. And there's a time to reach out. You know, some of us don't know when those times are. Some of us, all we do is stand up when we have a conflict and just get in somebody else's face and just move in like a bull and a child. Some of us, just all we do is back off, and we never even deal with it. There's a time to back off and seek God's counsel. That's what I mean about it. But there's also a time to stand up for what's right, and there's a time to give in. You know, when we were raising our daughters with all those books from Dobson – I discovered early on that I would a lot rather lose a few little insignificant battles that didn't amount to a hill of beans and win the bigger war. So I gave in on some non-essentials that I really didn't want to, but they didn't amount to anything. So there's a time to give in, but there's also a time then to reach out. And if you want to know the beautiful illustration of this, we were all in conflict with God. As you mentioned ago, we've all sinned and come short of the glory of God. We're all in conflict with God. So this is the story of the gospel. Christ came to mend the broken relationship. Christ came to reconcile us to God. Christ came to reconcile that conflict resolution. And so what did he do and how did he do it? Those four things. He backed off. See him in Gethsemane's garden the night before the crucifixion, neat those old olive trees, backed off, prayed, took in so he could give out at Calvary. If it's possible, Lord, let this pass from me. Nevertheless, not my will, but yours. Then secondly, we see him after backing off, standing up. He stood up before Caiaphas. He stood up before Annas. He stood up before Pontius Pilate. And then we see him giving in. Nobody pushed him or shoved him up the Via Dolorosa. He went as a lamb for the slaughter, willingly laid down. And finally on the cross, with arms outstretched, we see him reaching out as though he were saying, whosoever will may come. And through him, we can be reconciled to God.
SPEAKER 02 :
And the Lord will forgive and embrace and love. But it requires something on your part. We confess our sins.
SPEAKER 03 :
He's faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness.
SPEAKER 02 :
Hey, tell me that phrase again that I said I didn't understand in the beginning. Never cut what you can untie. All right. And related to the strings? Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
Related to conflict resolution. Take the time to untie those broken relationships.
SPEAKER 02 :
What's the next point from your book, The Nehemiah Code?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, we talk about how Nehemiah let go without letting up. The secret to what he did was his ability to delegate and to use other people. He let go without letting up. He was the master of this. He set clear objectives. Some of us are trying to rebuild businesses or churches. Set some clear objectives with specific tasks if you want people to be on your team. Let them know what to do. Pick the right person for the right job. So often we put the right person in the wrong job or the wrong person in the right job. Somewhere there's a job that each of us can do.
SPEAKER 02 :
Can you imagine Nehemiah setting out to rebuild a wall?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 02 :
What is it, 14, 18 feet thick?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, anybody that's been to Jerusalem has seen those stones.
SPEAKER 02 :
And they still last today even though they were torn down.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, right.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, he was a builder. And, you know, there's another principle I call yak. I like that. I got it from John Madden.
SPEAKER 02 :
I know about this one.
SPEAKER 03 :
Nehemiah would use this because it's a secret to rebuilding. You know, John Madden was an NFL coach and then color commentator on football games, NFL games. One of the best. One of the best. He coined an acronym, YAC, he called it. Yards After Contact. And it was the amount of yards that a running back, after he was hit initially the first time, how he moved forward, didn't crumble on the ground, didn't fall to the ground, how he kept moving forward toward the goal line. And from the time he was hit to where he went down, that was a new stat called yak. And this is exactly what Nehemiah did, because rebuilders deal with conflict head on. When they get hit, and we're all going to get hit, they don't just crumble or fumble the ball. They keep moving. They keep moving forward. They make some proper adjustments. They keep doing what's right. They rally their troops to greatness.
SPEAKER 02 :
I love that. YAC, Y-A-C, Yards After Contact. Every great runner keeps going when he's been hit. And he carries sometimes three or four or five people with him and sometimes across the goal line.
SPEAKER 03 :
And, you know, we're all going to face opposition. If you're not facing opposition from the devil, you're going in the same direction he is. So we're going to face opposition. And it's all a matter of how we deal with it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Our country is in the midst of conflict right now. And some people have given up. They sit down. Nehemiah did that to start with. He sat down and thought about it. But he got up and went and built a wall. And I think where we are now, we really ought to be doing some of that kind of thinking. I agree 100%.
SPEAKER 03 :
That's what the Nehemiah Code is about. It sets a pathway to us to rebuild anything. What did he eventually do? Did he finish the wall? In 52 days, the wall was completed. He finished strong. And the way he finished strong, actually, was that he stayed off the side streets by keeping focus, and he stayed off the sidelines by being faithful. And, you know, you and I both have seen people that, when they're running the last lap of life, fall on the track. Right. And I don't know about you, and I do know about you, but I know about me also. And one thing I want to do is I want to finish strong. I want to be like Nehemiah, get the job done, finish strong. God's given me a task to do, and that's exactly what I want to be about. You know, there's one of the secrets that I've found in my life. It came from a question that's actually in the Jesus Code, 52 Scripture questions every believer should answer in this code series. And it's the question that was asked in Isaiah 50. Does anyone fear the Lord anymore? Is there anyone who still fears the Lord? And you know, Dr. Dobson, if there is a forgotten subject in the church, it's the fear of God. How long has it been since you heard a sermon on the fear of God? How long has it been since you heard somebody teach on the fear of God? It's a forgotten subject. And the fear of God is not the fear that God is up there and has this big club of retribution. If we say something wrong or do something wrong, he's going to pound us over the head with it. We have to walk on eggshells. It's not the fear that God's going to put his hand on us. The fear of God is the fear that God might take his hand off of us. And if people would just live with that concept every day.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, instead of fear, I don't want to edit the Bible, but instead of fear, I think of the word awe.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, that's the word for fear in the Bible, reverential awe. In fact, in the book of Acts, it says that the early church was walking in the fear of the Lord and the comfort of the Holy Spirit, and they were multiplied. So, you know, they were walking in the fear of the Lord. They were living in this environment of the fear of the Lord that they didn't want to do anything that might cause God to take his hand of a blessing off him. All those Old Testament prophets lived in the fear of God. Noah, by fear, moved the ark, Hebrews 11 says. Moses. But he was going to the promised land. What does the Lord require of you, Deuteronomy 10? He asked him. But to fear him as you go. Joshua got the end of his life in chapter 24. His last words to his people. Now then, fear the Lord and serve him in all faithfulness. The Proverbs woman, 31. We bring her out every Mother's Day and make all the women feel guilty because they can't measure up to her. But the secret of her life is way down in verse 31. A woman who fears the Lord, she shall be praised. It's all through the Gospels.
SPEAKER 02 :
It is.
SPEAKER 03 :
Everywhere throughout Scripture. It's all through the book of Acts. It's all through the epistles. Submit yourselves one to another in the fear of the Lord, the Bible says. In fact, this is the way that we keep from sin. Proverbs 16, 6 tells us that by the fear of the Lord, one departs from evil. You know, there's a supernatural principle there that if you walk in the fear of God, he'll keep you from sin. What about Moses at Sinai when he talks about the fear of the Lord? It's all through the Bible. It'll keep us from sin. When we're walking in the fear of the Lord. God gives us a supernatural ability to overcome our sinful desires. I'll tell you something else he'll do. He'll give us supernatural wisdom to know the Word of God you're talking about a moment ago. Psalm 25, 14 says, By the secrets of the Lord are for those who fear him, and to them he'll reveal his covenants.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, I heard my dad say many times that never forget. And never doubt that the universe has a boss. Exactly. And he's not a winking, blinking grandfather who gives you everything you ask for. But he calls us to righteousness. Exactly. He calls us to stand for truth.
SPEAKER 03 :
And that same God hasn't abdicated his throne. His eyes still run to and fro over this whole world to show himself strong in behalf of those whose hearts are fixed on him.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's what worries me about our country because we have forgotten that fear, that awe. No question. And it's all through scriptures. If you read it, it'll speak to you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, no doubt about it. In fact, I would challenge your listeners that in your normal devotional time, every time you come across that concept, fear of God, circle it in your Bible, you'll be shocked. how many times it's there. And again, if our listeners today could just understand that the fear of God is not the fear God's going to put his hand of retribution on us, but the fear that he might take his hand of blessing and anointing off of us. And if we'd walk in that environment, it'd make a difference in what we do, what we say, where we go, and all those things of life. And we'd understand, as Nehemiah, that it's never too late for a new beginning.
SPEAKER 02 :
You are preaching still today in many places, aren't you?
SPEAKER 03 :
I am. In fact, I just ran into some of your friends at Scottsdale Bible the other day, and I preached at Michael Youssef's. Jay Snyder's a wonderful guy. I just was out at Church of the Apostles in Atlanta with Michael Youssef. I preach at First Baptist Dallas, my old church still, four or five times a year. Dr. Jeffers is so good to have me back. And so, yeah, but this is God has enlarged my coast. And I'd encourage people if they want to know more about all the code books or mission dignity to go to OSHawkins.com and they can get all the information.
SPEAKER 02 :
Let me remind people of what they are. You've written the Joshua Code, the Jesus Code. The James Code, the Daniel Code, the Believer's Code, the Christmas Code, and the linkage between all of those and the Nehemiah Code is taking a stand for what's right and what God has to say. Put it into your words. I'll put it into Joshua's words in Joshua 1.8.
SPEAKER 03 :
This book of the law shall not depart out of your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night in order that you may do all that is written therein, and then you'll make your way prosperous. Then you'll have good success. So these codes are just about getting us, not getting us into the Word of God, but getting the Word of God into us.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, one of the great pleasures of what the Lord has allowed me to do here is meeting people like you who come in, and I learn from every one of you. And you have been a blessing to me today, and I know to all of our listeners. The title of the book we've been talking about is The Nehemiah Code. It's Never Too Late for a New Beginning. Dr. O.S. Hawkins. You took a lot of time to come and be here. Thank you. Let's do it again. I'd love to. Thank you so much. God bless you, friend. Thank you, brother.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, just like Nehemiah's careful work of rebuilding Jerusalem's ancient walls, we too are called to be rebuilders in our own time, whether that means repairing broken relationships, strengthening our communities, or restoring what's been lost in our culture. You've been listening to Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk. and a hope-filled conversation about rebuilding and renewal featuring Dr. Dobson and his special in-studio guest, Dr. O.S. Hawkins. Now, if you missed any portion of today's broadcast, or if you'd like to share it with a friend or loved one, visit drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. That's drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. And once you're there, you'll find the complete program, both parts one and two, along with information about Dr. O.S. Hawkins' book called The Nehemiah Code. And by the way, if you're looking for more practical ways to strengthen your family, we've partnered with the Bible app by YouVersion to bring you free, easy-to-use reading plans that fit your busy schedule. Each plan offers Dr. Dobson's trusted insights on marriage, parenting, and family life delivered right to your phone or tablet. Ready to get started? Well, simply open the Bible app and then search for Dr. James Dobson or JDFI, more family talk, and discover resources that can transform your family one day at a time. Well, I'm Roger Marsh, and from all of us here at Family Talk, thanks so much for listening. Be sure to join us again next time right here for another edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Join Dr. James Dobson on this enlightening episode of Family Talk as he engages with Dr. O.S. Hawkins, a renowned figure in Christian ministry. Discover the remarkable journey of Dr. Hawkins from being a senior pastor to leading Guidestone Financial Resources, where his Mission Dignity program brings hope to retired pastors and their widows. The discussion revolves around the transformative power of faith, drawing wisdom from the biblical story of Nehemiah and how it can inspire us to rebuild important aspects of our lives.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh, and today we're joined by a beloved voice in Christian ministry, Dr. O.S. Hawkins, former senior pastor of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas. After many, many years in the pulpit, Dr. Hawkins followed God's call to lead Guidestone Financial Resources, where he has helped transform the lives of retired pastors and their widows through their Mission Dignity program. Dr. Now, you may know Dr. Hawkins from his popular Code series of devotional books, including The Joshua Code, The Jesus Code, and our topic for today, The Nehemiah Code. In today's conversation with Dr. Dobson, Dr. Hawkins will share an encouraging word about new beginnings, drawing wisdom from the biblical story of Nehemiah. Whether you're looking to rebuild relationships or start fresh in any other area of your life, you will not want to miss what these two doctors have to say on this most important topic. Let's get into this conversation right now on today's edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
Doctor? We are so pleased and honored to have a man here that many of you will recognize because his name is very well known in Christendom. He is Dr. O.S. Hawkins, who for years was the head pastor of of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, where Dr. W.A. Criswell was the beloved pastor for 50 years. I love that church. I've spoken there. Of course, Dr. Robert Jeffress is the senior pastor now, but Dr. Hawkins holds a doctorate of ministry from Luther Rice Seminary, and he's working on a PhD now at Southwestern Seminary, which will make him the oldest earner of a Ph.D. in the history of the school. Is that right? I think that's pretty close. And you're about to work on your dissertation. I am. Well, you're a Texan. I'm a Texan. We had dinner together, and I found out I really like you. I mean to tell you, I would like to be your friend for the rest of my life, and it would be just a pleasure to have you here again because you have the same values and the same beliefs that I do, and we have walked a similar path. And it's a pleasure to have you here. You flew here to be with us today. And God is blessing your life, isn't he?
SPEAKER 02 :
He is. And let me just say, for my wife Susie and myself, in the library of people we've always loved and respected, you and Shirley are way up there on the top shelf, because we couldn't have raised our girls back in the 70s and the 80s without Dare to Discipline, without Hide or Seek, and especially without The Strong-Willed Child. Susie told me today that she got that book out and looked at it again, and It's tear-stained all the way through it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you've got to bring her here the next time you come. I shall. You have two daughters.
SPEAKER 02 :
We have two daughters. And they're grown. Wendy and Holly. Wendy is an attorney. She and her husband are both attorneys in Dallas. They have two children. And then Holly, our youngest, is an author with Thomas Nelson with Children's Devotionals. And she's married to a young man who's one of the ministers at Prestonwood Baptist Church in Dallas.
SPEAKER 03 :
And they have four children. That's Dr. Jack Graham's church. It is. I've been there, too. I have in front of me a copy of the cover of Holly's book, I Can Learn the Bible. Gave a plug to that book some years ago, and I hope that it hasn't disappeared.
SPEAKER 02 :
No, you did, and she is greatly appreciated. She has that, and then she also has the children's devotional called I Can Learn to Pray, and they're incredible books for teaching our kids. You know, as parents, we want to teach our kids to learn the Bible. We want to teach them to pray. Sometimes we don't know how, and these are books that just help hold hands with parents and help them really know how they can lead their kids to do that.
SPEAKER 03 :
those things well you are no longer a pastor but you're working in a church context and in a way that is extremely helpful primarily to widows but to pastors and others who are having difficulty financially but describe for me what your application of the ministry is now
SPEAKER 02 :
In 1997, I left the pastor of the First Baptist Church in Dallas, where I love those people to this day and have such great memories of my days and years there. I left there to become president of Guidestone Financial Resources. It is a Christian evangelical mutual fund that serves 250,000 different participants over 300 years. Christian universities, 40,000 churches with all kinds of financial service needs. We're the world's largest Christian screen mutual fund. You just slurred past that, but say that again. Guidestone is the world's largest Christian screen mutual fund, $16 billion under assets right now. And we just received a few years ago from Lipper and Morningstar in New York, the number one mutual fund. in the country beating out 242 other mutual funds with assets of $40 billion and below. And so we're proving that you can keep your Christian values and still not sacrifice excellence in the investment arena.
SPEAKER 03 :
So our Guidestone Funds— That means you don't invest in any known association with—
SPEAKER 02 :
Our investment policy is that we don't invest in companies that are publicly recognized to be involved in alcohol, gambling, tobacco, abortion, pornography, or any other issues like that that are abhorrent to our Christian values.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now, you call this a ministry, and there's a reason for it. I alluded to it earlier explained.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. It's a ministry because we serve these pastors and churches. You know, our goal is to get a couple of these generations on our watch to vocational retirement with enough financial security that they don't have to be on somebody else's relief roll, that they can have enough financial security, they can volunteer for ministry and missions all over the world, because we also serve a lot of folks who don't have that privilege. We have a ministry called Mission Dignity. Dr. Dobson, we're on a mission to bring dignity to some forgotten folks, and that's retired pastors, and in most cases now, they're widows. Average age is about 85 in our program, living at the poverty level. These are folks who pastored out in the crossroads of life in seemingly forgotten places, lived in a church-owned home all their ministry, never made enough to get by much less.
SPEAKER 03 :
Many of them didn't even get Social Security because the church couldn't pay for it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. And they couldn't get by because they had no money to prepare for retirement. They were just trying to live from week to week and paycheck to paycheck. And so we come alongside them in their declining years. Ten years ago, we raised enough money to give them, I'm talking about thousands of people in this program, to give them $50 a month extra. But we've raised so much money recently, that the neediest among them now get $630 a month. One little pastor's widow, 87 years old, wrote me recently and said, I get to eat at night now, and it's not just a piece of toast. Isn't that unbelievable? Yeah. So to be Christ-hand extended to these people, it's close to the heart of God. In the book of James, the Bible tells us that pure and undefiled religion is this, to take care of widows. And that's all through the Scriptures. It's woven throughout the Scriptures, and it's our privilege to be Christ's hand extended. The beautiful thing about this program... is that we have endowed years ago all the expenses of the program. So everybody that works in the bookkeeping of it, everybody that works in the development program, all their salaries are paid out of this endowment. All the printed materials that we provide for the people, even the stamp that goes on the check to thousands of these people each month is paid for out of that endowment so that everyone who gives to Mission Dignity knows that every single penny they give goes to them. And we've raised $150 million. Wow. in the last 10 or 15 years for this. And all the royalties to my books, we have a code series of devotional books with Thomas Nelson.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we're going to talk about that today.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, they've sold over a million and a half copies in the last three or four years. And the reason I can talk about that is because all the royalties to all those books also go to these precious people in mission. You know, there's a baby boomer generation that's coming into retirement, and they're not prepared for retirement. And they're getting a double whammy. Some of them still have... aged parents that they're trying to take care of. And at the same time, they've got kids that are 30 or 40 years old that many of them are still providing for. So we've got a whole situation with mission dignity where we continue to grow it because of the growing need that's there. I would like everybody to remember that name. Say it again. Mission Dignity. Yeah, you can go to OSHawkins.com and click. There's a page there. You can click on Mission Dignity. Just listen to a few of the videos of these people and learn more about the program there.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I'm glad we had a chance to talk about that. We're actually here to talk about your book. And you mentioned that you have written a number of books. And the linkage to them all is the word CODE, C-O-D-E. And those books are? The Joshua Code, the Jesus Code, the James Code, the Daniel Code, the Believer's Code, the Christmas Code, and the Easter Code, and the one we're going to talk about today, the Nehemiah Code. What is the linkage between all this?
SPEAKER 02 :
I believe that there are nuggets of truth in Scripture, in these books of the Bible, that really, when they're mine, can give us a code to live on and to live by. And so these are all devotional books. And the secret to them, Dr. Dobson, is in the subtitle. For example, the first one is the Joshua Code. And the subtitle is 52 Scripture Verses. every believer should know. So it's a devotional book for a year where you take one verse of Scripture, memorize it that week. You know, Scripture memories are a lost art in Christian living. Memorize that verse that week. There are devotional helps on it there through it. And it's a year-long devotion. It comes from Joshua 1.8 that says, shall not depart out of your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night in order to do all that is written therein. Then you'll make your way prosperous. Then you'll have good success. So what I found was that there were a lot of people who wanted to get into the Word of God. They just didn't know where to start. They start in the book of Genesis, and by the time they get to Leviticus, they're bogged down. Or if they start in the New Testament, they get to Matthew, and they can't pronounce four-fifths of the names in the genealogy in Matthew 1. So I picked out 52 verses in the Bible. If you know these verses, you're going to know the message of the Bible. And if you know these verses, there are 52 verses I believe every believer should know before they go to heaven. And it had such success, it sold several hundred thousand copies, that we followed it up with the Jesus Code. Do you know, one of the things, I was reading through the Gospels just devotionally, and I was astounded by something interesting. I'd seen a hundred times before, but never really seen, if you know what I mean. And that was the numbers of times Jesus asked questions in the Scripture. He was always asking questions. Now, He didn't need answers. He was omniscient. He knew everything. But 150 questions are recorded in the Gospels that escape the lips of our Lord. It dawned on me that there are 52 Scripture questions every believer ought to answer before they go to heaven. And so we wrote the Jesus Code. Again, it's a devotional book, take you through a year, with 52 questions. If a man dies, shall he live again? All these questions in the Bible, most of them from the lips of Jesus. Who do you say that I am? That people ought to know before they get to heaven. And then we followed that up with the James Code of Practical Principles for Christian Living, the Daniel Code, how to really live in this culture, Daniel Code. was taken out of a culture that he lived in. And much like many of us, we're living in a new culture around us today and how he thrived in it. Then we have the Believer's Code, which is a 365-day devotional. And what's really taken off is the Christmas Code. And the Christmas Code is an Advent devotional, 25 sermons from December 1 to 25. And in the back of it is the plan of salvation, plainly experienced, where somebody could put their faith and trust in Christ. And it's a little paperback. There's a church in Syracuse, New York, wrote me, and they bought 9,000 of them and put them on every door ever. in a certain mile radius of their church with an invitation to their Christmas Eve service. That church runs about 800 or 900 in worship. 1,900 people showed up to their Christmas Eve service, and hundreds of people came to know.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you left the pastorate for another assignment, and yet you're probably preaching, quote-unquote, to more people now than you were then.
SPEAKER 02 :
In the pulpit. I preach almost every Sunday in the pulpit somewhere around the country. But through the printed page, God has just enlarged my coast and my sphere of influence. You know, there's an incredible verse of Scripture in 2 Corinthians 10-13. It says that God has assigned to us an area of influence. Now think about that. Somewhere there's somebody that every one of us can reach like no one else can because God has assigned an area of influence. Now you were a track star in high school. Oh, no. Well, you ran track with Bobby Morrow, the Olympic champion. That's him. Okay. But you ran track. Okay. So when the Corinthians were reading this and they saw that, they would have immediately jumped to their feet when they saw that Greek word Paul used to say that God has assigned an area of influence. It's the same Greek word that they would use in those Grecian games or we would use in track meets to describe a lane in which you're to run. When you run a relay race or you run in a track meet, you're assigned a lane and you can't get out of that. If you get out of that lane, you're disqualified and you have to run that race in that lane. And that's the word Paul used to say that God has assigned to every one of us a an area of influence. And so I want to just say this about you. You know, the word influence comes from two Latin words, in and flow. And the word picture is of this mighty river that's flowing vibrant and crystal clear and with a deep current, and into it run these little tributaries and streams and creeks that flow into it and are carried away in its flow. And that's where we get our word influence. And so I'm thankful to be here today because I'm one of those people of the millions that got caught up in Jim Dobson's flow. in that area of influence God assigned to you.
SPEAKER 03 :
That brings tears to my eyes because the truth of the matter is I can't take the credit for it. The Lord was doing something, and it was a shock to me all the way along as to what was happening. And the fact that he could use me, you know, Shirley and I were just college kids that got married and we really didn't know where the Lord was taking us. Although I was headed for graduate school, I knew what I wanted to do there. But it's just been amazing how doors have opened. And whenever I've gotten to a barrier, it has moved. And I couldn't do that. There's nothing I could do. And so it's almost scary to me to take the credit for what's taking place.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, the last chapter in the new Nehemiah Code that we're going to talk about in a moment is about finishing strong. And if anybody's ever finished strong, you and Shirley certainly are finishing strong. And, you know, going back to influence. In fact, I wrote a book that all the royalties also go to mission dignity called VIP. You know, that acronym. We couldn't exist in our vocabulary in English if we didn't use acronyms. I mean, we were talking about education a while ago. If you want to go to college to earn a BA, you better have a good GPA and you better score well on the SAT or you're not going to get a BA and then can't get an MA. You know, we're being protected by the CIA and the FBI right now. Now, April 15th, the IRS is going to come knocking on my door. I'm cancer-free today because of a test called PSA test. I use the ESV because I think the NIV is a little too eclectic. We live by acronyms, and no acronym has muscled and maneuvered its way into English vernacular more than that one, VIP. Very important person, because being important is the life goal of a lot of people. But I've changed that acronym because I think it's supposed to mean VIP. very influential person. You know, the world has a way of forgetting those people that deem themselves important, but we have a long memory when it comes to those who've influenced our lives. And so VIP, and I want to say this about you before you cut me off, because if you're going to be a person of influence, a VIP, those are the three things that are vital. V is for vision. People who influence others know where they're going. People don't follow people that don't know where they're going. I Somebody says, well, that ought to be intellect because knowledge is power. Somebody says it ought to be intensity and passion. No, it's for integrity. I've known a lot of people with a lot of great intellect had no integrity and aren't in the race anymore. And P is for purpose. They don't just know where they are going and who they are. They know why they're here. And Jim, the one thing about you is this. You've lived your life knowing where you were going, who you were, and why you're here. And because of that, God has enlarged the scope of your ministry, and even to this very day. My goodness.
SPEAKER 03 :
Again, that's very touching to me, and the Lord's blessed you in the same way, and continues to do so.
SPEAKER 02 :
I'm simply saying what millions of people would say if they were sitting in the microphone, having the opportunity to say thank you.
SPEAKER 03 :
I heard you speak at the Ruth Shanahan's funeral. This was, what, two years ago?
SPEAKER 02 :
Two years ago.
SPEAKER 03 :
And was very impressed by what you had to say there. She was a great lady, wasn't she?
SPEAKER 02 :
She was a wonderful lady. Came from a wonderful lady by the name of Mary Crowley, her mom. And I just got through preaching her brother, Don Carter's funeral here the other day. But Ruth Shanahan's one of the greatest women I know. And she loved two organizations. She loved three organizations. She loved our First Baptist Church in Dallas. She loved the Billy Graham Association, and she loved Jim and Shirley Dobson. And she gave her life to those organizations and her money to those organizations.
SPEAKER 03 :
She helped support Shirley's work in the National Day of Prayer as well as ours. So I love her for a bunch of reasons. Your book, again, is called The Nehemiah Code, but the subtitle is very important. It's never too late for a new beginning. A new beginning reminds me of Ronald Reagan, because when he was inaugurated all over town, there were these billboards and signs saying, A New Beginning. And we had one. And we did have one. And this book really comes back to that phrase in many of the illustrations and points that you make.
SPEAKER 02 :
And you know, no matter who we are, what we've done, where we live— It's never too late for a new beginning. You know, there are a lot of people needing a new beginning. There are people who've lost their self-confidence looking for a new beginning. People have been divorced and they're trying to start over. They need a new beginning. People have lost a spouse. It opens the page of a new chapter, a new beginning in their lives. Churches are looking to reach revitalized new beginning. Businesses are needing a new beginning. Coaches are rebuilding teams. Rebuilding process is something that touches every single one of us. And while many people just look at Nehemiah for the leadership principles that are there, what I believe the book is really about is the fact that it's never too late to rebuild our lives. It's never too late to rebuild the broken walls and the burned gates of our lives and have a second chance.
SPEAKER 03 :
That new beginning often involves repentance and reconciliation and forgiveness, doesn't it? You start there. I mean, none of us is perfect. We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. And he can take whatever mess you've made out of your life and make it new.
SPEAKER 02 :
You're in the middle of the bullseye because broken relationships, for example. There's an offending party and there's an offended party. In most cases, there's a little bit of both of us in all of them that get broken. But by and large, there's an offending party and an offended party. So two things have to happen for a new beginning. There must be, as you just said, a spirit of repentance on the part of the offending party. But there also has to be a spirit of reception on the heart of the offended party. And as a pastor for decades, one of the things I found in dealing with people's lives and broken relationships was often it was more the folks that just couldn't bring themselves to accept the fact the person had repented and received them back than it was the people that didn't repent to mend the broken relationship. So those two things are vital in doing that for sure. And forgiveness is the key.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we have just barely started the conversation about the Nehemiah Code, and the time is gone. You've flown here. Will you stay long enough to do another program with us? In a drop-dead, heartbeat minute. Well, we've got a lot to talk about here, and I can't wait to get into it. Great. I appreciate you. I appreciate your kind words to me, but they rebound from me to you immediately. And the life you've lived, you've lived a life of integrity and purpose. And thank you for being true to the gospel and to the one that we love, Jesus Christ. And he's continuing to bless you. Let's leave it there and pick it up next time. Wonderful. Wonderful.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, you've been listening to Family Talk and an inspiring conversation featuring our own Dr. James Dobson and his guest, Dr. OS Hawkins, about finding new beginnings through God's grace. These powerful insights remind us that it's never too late to rebuild, whether it's in a relationship, our faith, or our purpose in life. Now, if you missed any part of today's broadcast or if you'd just like to share it with someone who needs this message of hope, go to drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. And keep in mind, you can also access this program on the JDFI app as well. Well, today's program about hope and new beginnings and others like it are made possible through the generous support of friends just like you. If today's conversation about God's transforming power has touched your heart, would you consider partnering with us? Your tax-deductible donation of any amount helps us continue broadcasting biblical truth to families all across America and all over the world. You can make a secure donation online when you go to drjamesdobson.org. That's drjamesdobson.org. Or give us a call at 877-732-6825. And before we leave for today, I want to remind you about a helpful way to receive daily encouragement from Family Talk, and that's by signing up for our free reading plans on the Bible app by YouVersion. Whether you're waiting in the carpool or taking a quiet moment before bedtime, these brief devotionals offer practical wisdom for your family journey, featuring topics like a mother's impact on her children, Now, the plans are designed to fit your busy schedule while helping you build a stronger family on God's foundation. To access these free reading plans, simply open the Bible app on your phone or tablet and search for JDFI, the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. These bite-sized devotionals might be just what you need to bring fresh biblical perspective to your daily routine. I'm Roger Marsh, inviting you to join us again next time for part two of Dr. Dobson's powerful discussion with Dr. O.S. Hawkins. That's coming your way next time right here on Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
