As an obstetrician and gynecologist, Dr. William Lile has performed blood transfusions on babies in the womb as early as 18 weeks gestation. Not to mention operating on the heart of a 22-week-old baby in utero, when the stage of development of that vital organ is just the size of a grape! On today's edition of Family Talk, Dr. Lile asks the logical question, "If I'm providing medical care, doesn't that qualify the developing baby as my patient? It sure does! And if he's my patient, then he's a person, no matter how small." The scientific evidence that life begins at conception has become inescapable.
To support this ministry financially, visit: https://www.oneplace.com/donate/707/29
Join Dr. James Dobson in an engaging conversation with Jackie M. Johnson, author and executive assistant at the James Dobson Family Institute. As they delve into the emotional struggles and spiritual challenges of breakups, Jackie shares her encounters with love and loss, imparting wisdom on finding healing and hope. Whether dealing with rejection, anger, or a crisis of faith, this episode offers listeners guidance and encouragement to rebuild and find solace in God's divine timing. Listen as Jackie M. Johnson discusses how to cope with broken relationships and discover new beginnings with faith as the foundation.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, hello everyone. I'm James Dobson and you're listening to Family Talk, a listener-supported ministry. In fact, thank you so much for being part of that support for James Dobson Family Institute.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk. I'm Roger Marsh. You know, Valentine's Day is less than two weeks away, and this month we are tackling a topic that affects millions of Americans, the challenging journey of healing after a relationship ends. The pain of a breakup can feel overwhelming, leaving us with deep questions about God's plan and our own worth. Well, today here on Family Talk, we are joined by someone who understands that journey intimately. Author Jackie M. Johnson has written a book called When Love Ends and the Ice Cream Carton is Empty. And she shares her personal story of navigating difficult breakups and finding hope through faith. Through her own healing journey, Jackie discovered biblical principles that helped her move from heartache to hope, and she has poured these insights into three books that have touched countless lives, offered practical wisdom for those seeking to rebuild after relationship loss. Jackie's not only an accomplished author and avid blogger, she is also Dr. Dobson's executive assistant and a beloved member of the staff here at the James Dobson Family Institute. Whether you're currently healing from a breakup or know someone who is, today's conversation will remind you that you're not alone in your pain. But more importantly, you'll discover how God can transform even our deepest hurts into something beautiful. Here now is Dr. James Dobson with our guest, Jackie M. Johnson, on today's edition of Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now, today we're going to be talking about a program that we are long overdue in discussing. It's one that... I have cared about, I wrote about it in my book, Love Must Be Tough. But we have a guest here today who has experienced this single life, and she has written a book called When Love Ends and the Ice Cream Carton. is empty. We're going to have to have her explain that to us. Now, the reason this topic is so important is because the United States Census Bureau says that the average age for women to get married is now 27. Boy, that's changed a lot. And the average age for men is 29. And the people who get married at the average age are already nearly halfway through the fertile years of life. And that changes a whole lot. Additionally, there are 110 million unmarried people in the United States alone, most of whom have remained single for their whole life. Why have we not dealt with this subject more in the past? If you are single and you've waited for us to talk about this subject, today is today, and I'm sorry we've taken a long time to get to it. With people putting off saying, I do, until later in life or remaining single, the dating and breaking up experience that begins in the teen years can continue on until the early 50s. And no matter how young or old you are, breaking up can be an extremely difficult and emotionally draining experience. Before we went on the air, we were recalling a song that was popular In 1962, in fact, it hit number one. And I'm not going to sing it to you or we'd go off the air. Don't take your love away from me. Don't leave my heart in misery. Those of you who have lived a little longer in life may remember that because that was a very popular song. Well, I mentioned the guest who is here and the book she's written. Let me tell you more about her. She is an executive assistant to me here at James Dobson Family Institute. Her name is Jackie Johnson. She is good at what she does. And she's done a lot of thinking about this subject because she's been there. And we want to plumb the depths of of the topic with her today. She is an experienced writer. She's written three books. She writes a blog called Living Single. And she has a BA in English and Communication from Trinity International University in Illinois. Jackie, Shirley and I love and appreciate you so much. And it's time that we had you in the studio today. And thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you. It's good to be here.
SPEAKER 03 :
How long has this book been out?
SPEAKER 02 :
The book came out in 2010 with Moody Publishers. But the topic is timeless because people are always dating and breaking up. And they can use some help and hope and encouragement.
SPEAKER 03 :
I read in the prep for today that you've sold more than 500,000 books.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
Is that right?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
My goodness. You're a big deal.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I'm just trying to help people.
SPEAKER 03 :
Are most of those books on this subject?
SPEAKER 02 :
My other books are on the topic of prayer. And I think the overarching thing I write about is hope and encouragement. And that can take a lot of different forms. So I'm glad to be here today to talk about this.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jackie, let's go back to Neil Sadaka's song. Why is breaking up so very, very hard?
SPEAKER 02 :
It is hard. Letting go is never easy because you have to say goodbye to someone that you loved or you liked. And the thing is, you've been spending time with this person. You've grown attached to them. You probably might be in love with them, especially if it's a long-term relationship. And now you're on your own again. It's a transition. And I think it's hard to recover from a breakup because I think God designed us for attachment and connection, not for detachment and disconnection. Sometimes we go through these series of hello, goodbye, dating and breaking up, relationship after relationship. And sadly, nobody teaches us how to get over a breakup or how to deal with endings.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, I've not seen another book on this subject. Yeah. Let's name some of the emotions that go along with it. There is rejection, and there is loneliness, and there is pain and hurt and sorrow.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
And there are many, many other emotions that accompany it that describe some of them.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. Hurt and sadness are really the most common. You could be angry. You could feel betrayed. They could have found somebody else and put you by the wayside. Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
Sometimes the breakup is not very kind either, isn't it?
SPEAKER 02 :
That's true. That's true. I've gone through a number of relationships. One guy moved halfway across the country and wouldn't return my phone calls.
SPEAKER 03 :
And this is somebody you had a relationship established?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes, for over a year.
SPEAKER 03 :
He didn't return your phone call.
SPEAKER 02 :
No. So he was a coward, and he would not even talk to me. I had someone break up with me over email after two years. You've got to be kidding. No, we did talk the next day or two in person, but the information came to me by email. So I think that if you do break up with someone— You want to be kind. You want to be respectful. You want to speak the truth in love. That's what the Bible says. Speak the truth in love.
SPEAKER 03 :
You called them cowards to do that.
SPEAKER 02 :
I did, yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
Would you agree that women are more likely to suffer from the breakup of a relationship?
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, that's an interesting question, Dr. Dobson, because I've heard the phrase that women bend but men break. And sometimes I think women do feel that emotion strongly, but maybe we have better coping mechanisms because we have our friends to lean on. We have the Bible to lean on. We're looking for answers of how to get over it. And maybe not to generalize, but sometimes men tough it out and try to figure it out on their own or stuff their emotions.
SPEAKER 03 :
You mentioned cowardice. I think that's one reason people do such a bad job of letting the other person know that it's not going to work. They had rather write an email. I mean, that's about the worst thing I've heard.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. And it's hard to believe that someone who once said they liked you or loved you would treat you in this fashion and say nothing or not speak with you face to face. I think as believers that we are to do. Be respectful and be gentle. And here we are trying to speak the truth in love. I know I just said that, but, you know, there's a way to do it and a way not to do it. Because the thing is, if you don't deal with your breakup pain, then you carry it from one relationship to the next, to the next, to the next. And that can affect your dating life and possibly your future marriage.
SPEAKER 01 :
You're listening to Family Talk, and that was our host, Dr. James Dobson, with his guest, Jackie M. Johnson. Jackie is the author of the book, When Love Ends and the Ice Cream Carton is Empty. She and Dr. Dobson have been talking about the pain of breakups and what to do when a relationship doesn't work out the way you planned. Let's return now to Dr. Dobson's conversation with Jackie Johnson right here on Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let's talk about what changes when you have established a relationship and you have the assumption that that's leading to marriage. And you've built your future around marriage. that relationship because you foresee marriage and children. You know, I think at that point, women do suffer more than men typically because they hear Big Ben gonging in the background. The time is passing. And I mentioned earlier the fertility period. It's only about 27, 28 years, maybe 30. And the latter end of that, it's sometimes not easy for a And as the time goes on, another year, another Christmas, another Easter, another summer, and you get closer and closer to that time when the dream of having a baby and raising a child and pouring your life into him or her It's becoming less and less likely. So when a breakup occurs, all that looms before you. I got to start over now with somebody else. And this is getting away from me. There's a panic that is associated with that experience, isn't there?
SPEAKER 02 :
There can be, definitely, especially if you're a woman who wants to have children and have a family. Let me give you an illustration from my own life. I was dating someone for two years, which is a pretty long time. We met in our church singles group, and we did everything together. We went on mission trips. We were in a prayer group together. We were in leadership. We spent a lot of time together. And then I went away on a trip, came back, and he was the one who sent me the email that said he had found somebody else. And this person— Did you know the person he found? I did. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
You got to be kidding.
SPEAKER 02 :
No, she was in our singles group as well. And he told me by email that he felt led to now be with her. So it kind of felt like a double betrayal because.
SPEAKER 03 :
Fell led. I mean, that is a cowardly statement in itself. Blame it on God. You know, I haven't done this to you. God told me not to. continue the relationship. I don't believe that's likely to be true in most cases.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, it was really difficult, Dr. Dobson, because we had talked about marriage. We had talked about should we have children or not. We had talked about a future. And I was stunned. I was shocked. I think I was in shock because I didn't see it coming. I had no idea. And this person was a friend of mine. So You know, I felt like there was a double betrayal in that he never said anything, she never said anything. I felt rejected. Why did he pick her over me?
SPEAKER 03 :
There is also a certain assault on self-worth that occurs at a time like this, isn't there? There's this ache that says, what's wrong with me? you know, why did this happen to me? There's also a spiritual dimension to it. You and I talked before about the fact that people blame God, speaking of Him, and say, why would you let this happen to me? Didn't you hear my prayers? You know, was there something wrong with my prayers that you didn't hear it? And now this has occurred. Are those things you talk about in your book
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. I thought a lot about what I wanted to include in this book because, like you said, I couldn't find another book that would help me. Where were the Bible verses? Where was the comfort? Where was the hope and the encouragement? Where is God in all of this? What do I do with forgiveness? I mean, a lot of things were swirling in my head.
SPEAKER 03 :
Anger is one of them, isn't it?
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. Definitely.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jackie, did anybody help you? Did anybody come alongside and put an arm around you, any girlfriend, anybody, pastor, who said, Jackie, you're going to get over this. You're going to deal with this. This is very painful. But you are a worthy person, and God has not abandoned you. Did anybody talk to you that way?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes, I am really blessed to have a good group of friends. And my friends are very comforting and nurturing and supportive. They prayed for me. They prayed with me. There was even a class at our church about getting over loss. So it wasn't specifically for a breakup, but I thought, well, I guess that's the closest thing that I could find to it. But, you know, you talked about my relationship with God and how that plays into all this. Sure, I had a ton of questions. You know, why did this happen? Why am I not enough? Why is God keeping me from lasting love? And it took me a really long time. I would search the scriptures. I would sit on my bed with a pen and paper and look for every single word about hope, about encouragement, about getting over a loss. And as a Christian, I can look to the one who loves me most and which is Jesus Christ, and have a new perspective. That new perspective is God's truth, and God's truth doesn't change. And one of the main things I learned was that God is not withholding from me something good. He's protecting me and saving me for his best. And I can trust him even when I do not understand. That was huge.
SPEAKER 03 :
You can trust him even when you can't track him is one of my phrases. I also wrote a book similar to this. It's not specifically about singles, but it's about the breakup of a marriage and what happens. But I believe... What I wrote there is very much relevant to the breakup of a couple that's not married. And I don't know anybody else that's written this, Jackie, but I believe it's absolutely true. And I've gotten thousands of letters from people saying this was helpful to them. When you begin to sense... That the other person doesn't feel about you the way you feel about them. In your case, you were blindsided. But usually, you're seeing the other person drift. The natural tendency in that situation is to grab and hold. to plead, to beg, to say, you can't do this to me. What will I do without you? To build a cage around them. You know what that does to the other person? It sends them the other way. It's the quickest way to end a relationship. When you begin to show that you're in a state of panic, which is the usual way because the whole world falls apart. Everything you had hoped for, everything you look forward to in the future, a life together as a family, and now it's gone. And if what I just said is true, the best thing you can do in a moment like that is to move the other way. sometimes the person who is moving away will turn around and come back. And I can tell you that happened with Shirley and me, because I graduated from college before she did, and I went off to the Army, and I came back one Christmas. She had assumed the relationship was going to continue. What I was thinking is, that as soon as I get out of the Army, I'm going to the University of Texas to get a Ph.D., and I can't afford a wife, and I need to give my attention to my studies, and I don't think that we are headed toward marriage. And how do I tell her this? Well, there ain't no easy way. So at the end of the Christmas vacation— We went out and we had an absolutely wonderful evening. We laughed, we had fun. We came back about 12 o'clock at night to her dorm. And I said to myself, this is the moment. And I said, Shirley, I've been doing a lot of thinking. And I just need to tell you, I don't think this is leading to marriage. And I've got plans of what I think the Lord wants me to do. And I think that we ought to see other people. You ever heard that one before?
SPEAKER 02 :
I read your book. And Mrs. Shirley Dobson has inspired me.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, she did exactly the right thing. Instead of begging me and putting her arm around me and saying, don't do this to me. She said, well, I've been thinking the same thing, and I think we should see some other people, and I think we ought to just kind of go our separate ways, and we'll put it on hold for a while. We'll see what happens. I took her to the door, shocked the daylights out of me because I thought that I was in for a very emotional ordeal.
SPEAKER 02 :
Sure.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we stood at the door. I asked her if I could kiss her goodbye, and she said no, a shake on it. And with no ado, she went into the dorm. And she went into her room and cried all night. If I had seen that, I would have been gone forever. But the way she let me go, by the time I got back to where I was staying, at 1, 2, 3 o'clock in the morning, I was lying there thinking about having hurt the best friend I ever had. And I began to get this big lump in my throat. And I wondered if I could get her back. And I went on to the Army, went to Fort Ord. I called her. And I said, I couldn't see the forest for the trees. And I've made a big mistake. And I think we ought to continue the relationship. She was very cool. And I wrote her a big long letter. And she didn't answer it for two weeks. She was dying inside. And by the time I came out of that episode, I didn't want to repeat it. That's personal, but I've seen now in so many others who either break up as singles or they get married and then have a horrible ripping and tearing of flesh. That's what you're writing about, isn't it?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. That's really important for people to know.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, we're almost out of time, Jackie, but we're not out of content. We need to talk some more. And the name of the book is When Love Ends. Okay, we're going to take the end of the program, the last 30 seconds, for you to tell what in the world that has to do with the ice cream carton is empty, the subtitle of the book.
SPEAKER 02 :
Sure, right. You know, so many times in movies and TV you see somebody breaking up, the girl sitting on her bed with an ice cream carton, you know, like a pint size, and she's got the spoon and she's crying and eating ice cream. And, you know, it's kind of a popular thing, especially women do, to comfort themselves after a breakup. But what we're going to learn is that there are healthier and better ways to cope.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let's talk about them next time.
SPEAKER 02 :
Okay, that'd be great. Thank you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jackie, thanks for writing this book, for your care for singles. And I think you're going to hear from some people out there who are going through this right now. We'll talk about it next time.
SPEAKER 01 :
Even the most painful endings can become beautiful beginnings when we learn to trust God's bigger plan for our lives. You've been listening to Family Talk and a powerful conversation about healing after heartbreak featuring our own Dr. James Dobson and his guest author Jackie M. Johnson. Jackie's journey from personal pain to ministry reminds us that God can transform our deepest hurts into sources of hope for others. Now, if you missed any portion of today's broadcast, or if you'd like to share it with a friend who needs to hear this message, you can always find that audio on our app or by visiting drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. There you'll also find the information about Jackie Johnson's book, When Love Ends and the Ice Cream Carton is Empty. Again, go to drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. And be sure to join us again next time. You'll hear part two of this powerful conversation. Well, speaking of hope and healing, I want to tell you about a wonderful free resource from the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. We've created several inspiring reading plans available through the Bible app by YouVersion, covering topics from relationships to parenting to finding God's purpose for every season of life. Whether you have three minutes or 30, these reading plans bring practical biblical insights right to your smartphone. Just open the Bible app on your phone or tablet, search for Dr. James Dobson, and begin your first reading plan today. Here at the JDFI, we are committed to helping people find healing and hope through biblical truth. These daily broadcasts are made possible through the generous support of friends just like you who value having a trusted voice to turn to during life's challenging seasons. If today's program about finding hope after heartbreak has touched your heart, Again, that's P.O. Box 39000. Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. Well, I'm Roger Marsh, and on behalf of Dr. Dobson and all of us here at Family Talk, thanks so much for listening. Be sure to join us again next time when you'll hear the conclusion of Dr. Dobson's conversation with author Jackie M. Johnson, right here on Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Join Barbara and Darren as they explore the importance of seeking new opportunities and stepping out in faith. Listen to testimonies of individuals finding miracles on their journey and learn how changing your environment can lead to new beginnings and fulfillment in life. Through candid conversations, they emphasize the transformative power of prayer, the necessity to leave comfort zones, and trusting in God's perfect plan for our lives.
SPEAKER 01 :
Welcome to Call to Freedom with Barbara Carmack. This is Jimmy Lakey, and I'm delighted that you are joining us for this half hour. You can reach Call to Freedom at Box 370367, Denver, Colorado, 80237, or by going to the website at www.freedomstreet.org. If you want to leave a message or order a Word Power Daily Reading Bible Guide or a Freedom Street Express newsletter, you can call us toll free at 1-877-917-7256 and leave your name and address, including your zip code. If you want to talk to Barbara right now, she is expecting your call. You may call that same toll-free number, 1-877-917-7256 to speak to her. And now, let's join Barbara in the studio.
SPEAKER 02 :
You will be listening to a Darren Live broadcast today. By the amount of calls and emails I've received, you have enjoyed hearing shows from the past. On this program, Darren and I talk about the negative effect that fear has on a person's life. And we discuss the fact that God has not given you a spirit of fear, but of power and love and a sound mind. Thank you for joining us today. approach it as an opportunity to see God at work in your life. As we join the broadcast, Darren is talking about our special friends, Jack and Nancy. Let's join this Encore Darren Live program now.
SPEAKER 06 :
And we've been doing those meetings there for over three years. And we probably should have kept a Tuesday miracle log because we've had so many. And people getting born again, set free, finding new friends. The list could go on and on. And, you know, even Jack was mentioned in the newspaper out in Strasburg.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah. Yes.
SPEAKER 06 :
Jack the meter man.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes. The meter reader.
SPEAKER 06 :
It was really, really a neat article about Jack. Jack and Nancy are frequent visitors to our class. In fact, not just visitors. They're kind of old timers. But we have a good time and we see people growing in the Lord. And that's so exciting to me to see people that are fighting that great big monster, the big main monster the devil throws against us as that monster called fear. And it's not just called a monster in scripture. It's called a spirit monster.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's right. And it is sin. When we give into those things, so many of us, we give into fear or we give into anxiety or worry. And I know some people don't believe those are sins, but those are sins. And it says God didn't give us the spirit of fear. And it's because it is so detrimental in our lives. God isn't that kind of God to give us that fear. But he gave us power and love and a sound mind. And Darren, that's such a reassurance. Praise God. I need to apologize. I need to apologize to you and the listening audience. You're speaking to me? Yes, I'm speaking to you. I need to apologize to all of you because yesterday Holy Spirit was nudging me saying, you know, you had a couple of prophetic words for people and he was saying ears, ears. and someone has a problem with their ears, and they just cannot hear. It's either a big vacuum, it's like they're inside of a drum, or it's ringing, or something like that. And I didn't say anything on the show. Of course, we had three calls, and half an hour just goes boom, boom, and it's gone. And so all afternoon, he kept... telling me about ears last night. We get to the meeting and we had such a great time. And I'll tell you, over 50 people came during that. It was windy and cold. I mean, and I'll tell you, I was amazed. We have some really true diehards in the Lord. I just, I love all of you. Praise God.
SPEAKER 06 :
What's your apology?
SPEAKER 02 :
So, and then I get there and during prayer, Holy Spirit is saying ears again. And I didn't do it. And I just ask your forgiveness because I got home and I started reading the envelopes. And one of the prayer requests was, please pray for my ears. I have ringing in my ears. So in Jesus name, I thank you, Father God, that if this person is listening or any of you that have problems with your ears this morning. Put your hand over your ears in Jesus name. I know Holy Spirit wants to heal you because he was nudging me all day yesterday. I asked his forgiveness and he is ready to heal you today. And in Jesus name, I thank you, Father, that you are going by the unction of Holy Spirit to everyone that has a problem in their ears so that they can open their ears, their natural ears in here. And Father God, I ask also that you open their spiritual ears. to hear the word of God. In Jesus' name, thank you for this healing. Hallelujah. Amen.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, we also had a marvelous miracle shared with us last night. A lady who received a tremendous miracle in the class probably two months ago has been coming alone by herself the last few weeks because her husband was working night shift. Well, he held up his hand last night. He said, I had a major miracle. I got a new job and twice the pay that I had before.
SPEAKER 05 :
Isn't that great?
SPEAKER 06 :
And, you know, we prayed for things like that, that God would just bring around the best employment possible But he's the type of guy that will go out and ask, make himself available for those openings. And, you know, you can pray and pray in your prayer closet, but some days you have to get out and go out and fill out a job application. You have to go out and make a move. And I have a letter in front of me here, and I'll let you put the name on this guy that you want to put on him. I mean, if you would describe this guy.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, we can just call him Single Guy.
SPEAKER 06 :
Single Guy. Okay. In fact, that's the way he signed his letter. Now, I'm not going to tell you whether he's in Garden City, Kansas, Georgetown, Colorado, Carr, Colorado, Otis, Joe's, Raton, New Mexico, down in Canadian, Texas. I'm not going to say where this guy's from, okay? But he's from a small town. Okay, here's what he says. Dear Darren, I'm writing to you because during your show I'm working. I don't always get a chance to listen to your show. I don't have a computer. Now here's my details. I'm 36 years old, a male. I've never been married. I have no kids. That's good. Darren, I'd like to be, well, I mean, you shouldn't probably have kids if you have never been married, right?
SPEAKER 05 :
That's true.
SPEAKER 06 :
I would like a miracle because I live in a small town and all the Christian women here are in high school. Well, he probably should draw a line through that option.
SPEAKER 02 :
I don't think that's the total truth, though, either. I think there are other single women who are Christians.
SPEAKER 06 :
He said, yes, I am a born-again Christian. I want to meet the soulmate of my life. Pray for me. Would you write to me and let me know? Well, instead of writing, I'm going to send him a copy of this tape. But here's what I'm going to say. You know, I've driven up and down I-25 for many, many thousands of miles. I've never seen anybody catch trout in the middle of I-25. Well, you say, how stupid an illustration. Well, no, it's not really stupid. The reason you don't catch trout in the middle of I-25 is there's no trout there.
SPEAKER 05 :
That's right.
SPEAKER 06 :
So if you want to find trout, you're probably going to have to get off the highway and drive up in the mountains and find a stream where there is some trout.
SPEAKER 02 :
And we're not saying there are no single Christian women there, but he just hasn't met them.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, it sounds like it. But here's my point. If I want to catch catfish and I'm fishing for catfish, I've just got to have catfish. Probably I'm going to have to maybe go to Kansas or down in Oklahoma or down into Texas. I'm going to go down where they have a lot of warm water. If I want catfish, if you're going to catch what you're after, you got to go where they are. That's my point. And I, you know, we have a lot of people talk to us and they give us, they give us, they just think they've got an impossible situation. No, you know, there are no borders there. keeping you from driving to Denver. And there are a lot of single, wonderful Christian ladies here in Denver.
SPEAKER 02 :
Job opportunities are absolutely wonderful. Job opportunities are wonderful. In fact, probably better than in this little town.
SPEAKER 06 :
In this little town. Okay. Also, I know a little bit about Tulsa, Oklahoma. I mean, there's an abundance of singles there, both men and women. And if you're not finding what you're looking for where you are, guess what? Get yourself in the vehicle and get going.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's right. There's Bible school there, and I'll tell you, there are people that are 45 and 50 going to that Bible school.
SPEAKER 06 :
And some older than that.
SPEAKER 02 :
And I know two men from this exact area where he's from. After graduating from high school, they went to Tulsa, and they found their wives in Tulsa. I mean, we just read here in Genesis, Darren, about Isaac. He didn't have a wife, and Abraham sent the servant to the foreign country, Haran, which was many days east of where they lived. to find a wife for him. Also, Jacob, he ran away from home for fear of his brother Esau, but he found a wife in another country also. So they left home and they found a wife. Now, if you say, well, I can't leave home, then you are limiting God because there's no such thing as I can't. I know I lived in the Greeley area for 40 years. And Darren, when you were talking about moving to Denver, I said, oh, this is home. I can't do that. And God almost had to kick me out of there. But he did. And praise God that he did, because our life has changed. And I'm so fulfilled and satisfied.
SPEAKER 06 :
And you like Denver.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, I love Denver. Yes. A lot of people in like city.
SPEAKER 06 :
We happen to like it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I'm from the country. I was raised on a farm.
SPEAKER 06 :
Now, here's what we're saying, folks. Some of you are where you are, and you're complaining because there are just no opportunities. And I would agree with you. In some communities, there are very limited or no opportunities, maybe for marriage or for job, for employment, for advancement. Don't let fear keep you there. You may be in a very comfortable paralytic. Now, I want you to hear me, paralytic loop situation. Some of you are in a paralytic loop in the middle of Denver saying, oh, I just can't find a good church. Oh, I just can't find anybody to fellowship. I can't find anybody to lay hands on me and pray the prayer of faith and put their faith with mine so I can get healed. Or I could find a better job if somebody just agreed. Oh, I can't find any good friends. Hey, try Tuesday night. We have some delightful people on Tuesday night.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, or try so many times in these apartment complexes, there's community centers. Try getting out of your little four walls and meeting the person across the hall or meeting the person down the street. It does take effort on your part. You cannot sit at home, watch television and expect to find somebody or a job or be in fellowship. That is impossible. And so we encourage you. You must make a decision. God has the best for you, but you have to believe that if he sends you somewhere, it's the very best for you.
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, I've talked to quite a few people that were doing the loop, and they were paralyzed in their situation. And they said, oh, Brother Darren, would you pray for me? And they'd give me a request, something like this. You know, I need to find a wife, or I need to find a husband, or I need to find a better job. And I have a rather creative mind, so I'd stand there for a little bit, and I'd say, well, have you thought about it? Oh, no, I couldn't. No, no, that wouldn't work. And, you know, you go through six or eight or ten options. And then they got all the reasons why that wouldn't work. And then I walk away saying, well, guess I just found out why it just won't work for them. They're going to be locked in. Or I might tell somebody, you know, you could be healed. Oh, let me tell you about my family. They start giving me their family medical history. And I say, now I know why you're not healed. is you have accepted the limitations of your situation, and that's tragic. That is really, really tragic.
SPEAKER 05 :
It is.
SPEAKER 06 :
Don't allow the devil to get you in a corner and plaster up all the walls and do all that kind of stuff, and then you tell me, well, I just can't get out of here. Yes, you can. Mm-hmm. Yes, you can. And praise God, we still live in a free country. Bless God. And there are no fences across I-70 or I-25 or I-80. We flew this weekend down to Phoenix, and there weren't any doors on Phoenix keeping us out of there or out of Tucson. And when we got back to Denver, there were no barbed wire fences keeping us out of Denver.
SPEAKER 02 :
Praise God.
SPEAKER 06 :
Now, come on, folks. There's a way to change your circumstances, and it might be that you have to put down your pet little idol called fear. Now, I have been there. I know what it's like to feel fearful. I know what it's like to say, well, there's new territory. I mean, could I get a job? Yes, I've driven clear across the country and found a job in a brand-new city.
SPEAKER 02 :
I think it also involves laziness, too, because we get into a rut or we get into a schedule or a routine. And the very idea of getting out of that is just absolutely impossible for us to think about. And because we're so familiar with what we're doing, we can't possibly get into any new adventure or area. And I say, wow, that is that's tremendous to be able to think about. Hey, I'm going to do something brand new that I've never done before and get excited about it.
SPEAKER 06 :
And you've got to know this, that God is in your town, whether it's a little town, a big town, or a big city. He's there. But he's also down the road and around the bend and over the hill. He's there also. And if you give him a chance, and I look at it this way. When I drive through the farming communities, I look at a grain elevator, and sometimes I see these trucks that drive in for a load of grain. And you know that grain is not going to come out in the middle of the street. It's not going to be half a mile down the other end of town. You have to get under that spout in the elevator for that grain to drop in your truck. Some of you are trying to get God's glory where you are. And God says, look. My glory is going to be on your life and my blessing is going to be on your life 50 miles down the road. And you're going to have to move. If you're going to find that place of blessing, you're going to have to move.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, that's what he did with Abraham. That's what he did with Joseph. That's what he did with many, many.
SPEAKER 06 :
Abraham's father was an idol maker. They had to be very wealthy, but God says, Abraham, you're moving. And he didn't have a map. He didn't really know where he was going. He just believed God and went for it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, and he had much more success than if he would have stayed there. Also, I have a verse from Genesis 28, verse 20 through 22, when Jacob had run away from home to go to his uncle Laban's house, his mother Rebecca's brother. And he saw a ladder going down from heaven and angels up and down the ladder. I think that was God telling him, I'm going to take care of you, Jacob. And Jacob said something to God. God, if you will be with me and will keep me on this journey that I take and give me food to eat and garments to wear, and I can return to my father's house in safety, which he did many years later. Then this stone, which I have set up as an altar, as a pillar will be God's house. And of that thou does give me, I will give you a 10th of all that you give me. Now, this is the second time that this tide is mentioned once with Abraham meeting Melchizedek. Now with Jacob, I believe Darren, when we put God first and we say, God, I'm going to get to know you and you're going to bring all of my desires together. If this young man can say, Father God, I'm going to give you the first part of my day. I'm going to make sure that I tithe and I give you what is yours. And I'm going to make sure that my life is congruent, Lord, the way you asked me to do it. Then God will bring the woman in his life. I truly believe that.
SPEAKER 06 :
Now, I believe this too, Barbara, that many times God just gives us a choice. And let me give you an example. We talked to a lot of people are from North Dakota. So let me pick on North Dakota for a minute. If you don't like real cold winters and real hot summers, you probably shouldn't live in Bismarck, North Dakota. Now, I haven't lived there, but that's what they tell me. They have hot, hot summers and they have real cold winters. Well, guess what? You have a choice. And if you don't like cold weather, why don't you move south? And, you know, God may just be saying, you know, I don't care whether you live in Albuquerque or whether you live in Riverside, California, or whether you live in Tucson, Arizona. I don't really care. Or maybe you want to go down to Brownsville, Texas. I just don't care. But see, I believe that he gives us many times that choice.
SPEAKER 02 :
I know. I've always wondered when there's a great flood along a river or something and all their houses are absolutely flooded. And this doesn't happen just once in 100 years. This happens maybe every 25 or 30 years. Or every 10 years. They've got to rebuild. Or on the slopes of California and their house goes down to the sea and they build there again. I'm going... Are they stupid or something? I mean, I would get up on the shore far away, at least two or three miles away, if I knew that might happen again. And people are, what are they, creatures of habit? They have got to go and rebuild again.
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, many people tend their life, I should have, would have, could have, you know, I could have done better, I should have moved, and they didn't move.
SPEAKER 02 :
They didn't move.
SPEAKER 06 :
They didn't move.
SPEAKER 02 :
And they got destroyed, man.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, let's talk to, there's a lady on the phone, Pam in North Glen, how are you?
SPEAKER 04 :
Hi, Darren. Hi, Barbara. Hi. How are you? Doing good. Great. Last night when I left the meeting, and I was talking to you, Barbara, last night about my husband.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 04 :
And a ton of bricks fell on me as I was turning the corner into the driveway. My husband is a reasoner and a planner. And I know you're supposed to ponder. And that's a lot different than reasoning, isn't it?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 04 :
And... How do I go about praying that reasoning thing away from him?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I believe that Ephesians 1, 17 and 18 is really good. And I would really pray to know that he is, I mean, born again. I know sometimes it's really hard for a wife to sit down with a husband and Honey, do you really know that Jesus is Lord of your life? If you know that, then you can read Ephesians 1, 17 and 18 and pray that for him, that his eyes, the spiritual eyes would be open for him. Because I know you and I have talked about it, that he just doesn't believe in giving to the Lord. And that is a real important part of being a born again Christian. And so we need to ask God to change that mindset that he has, because it is really carnal. It is a carnal mindset that he has. So change those patterns of what he grew up thinking and hungering and thirsting. That's another thing you need to pray for him. Matthew five, six. Oh, good. Good. That's great.
SPEAKER 06 :
I would bless your husband with the thirst for righteousness. And Pam, let me say this to you. I spent several years in college. But if the colleges had the answers, you know, we'd be lined up from here to Boulder trying to break the doors down to get in there. And the answers for mankind are not really found at the mind and the reason level. They're found in the heart. And one reason we have so many metal breakdowns in the United States is we try to reason and we're trying to make the mind do something God didn't create it to do. The mind really needs to be a servant of the spirit. So can I read a little scripture to you? Sure. Okay, in Romans 8.6 it says, For it does not subject itself to the law of God. It's not even able to do so. And those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, that's good.
SPEAKER 06 :
And, you know, we try to get people to have a spiritual identity, and many people try to have a mental identity. They say, above all, I have to reason, I have to think, I have to figure things out, I have to deduct, I have to, you know, all that stuff. And that person is really bound that does that. So I suspect your husband is bound just because he's depending on his mind too much.
SPEAKER 04 :
That's what I see here more and more that I've been home. Right.
SPEAKER 06 :
So then fear, of course, is right there at the door to paralyze a person's thinking. And this is a scary world. If you don't really trust in God, this is a scary world. Because all you have to do is read just the headlines. If you didn't read the paper, just read the headlines. Just listen to a little CNN news. I mean, you'd freak out. And it's no wonder that there are a lot of people committing suicide today. And a lot of the younger people today are taking that option of suicide. They're saying, hey, the adults haven't figured this out. They've screwed up our world. And I just think I'm just going to check out. And a lot of them do. And that's because they're trying to reason it out, trying to figure it out. And there are a lot of things, very honestly, you just plain won't figure. Know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah. Now, he won't let you give your tithe, right?
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, we go around and around about it. I'm trying to be a submissive wife, which is hard for me to do sometimes. But he's a money handler, and he does it really well. Except for that.
SPEAKER 02 :
Does he do it really well? Yes, he does. Do you have everything that you desire?
SPEAKER 04 :
Um...
SPEAKER 02 :
90% of it, yes. Do you? Okay. I'm saying if you would talk to him and say, could I take the money that I earn and give that 10%? You're not asking him to give you all the paycheck to God, all your paycheck to God. You're just asking for 10% of your paycheck. And let's do an experiment for 90 days.
SPEAKER 04 :
Okay. I was going to suggest that, but. With me not working for the past couple of months, I know that's a lame excuse.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, but now you are working again, right?
SPEAKER 04 :
I'll be starting here at the end of the week. Okay.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I would agree with Barbara there. I believe God will just do things for you.
SPEAKER 04 :
I do, too.
SPEAKER 06 :
Your husband needs to see something.
SPEAKER 04 :
That's right.
SPEAKER 06 :
God's not beyond being challenged there. In fact, this is one area and only area in Scripture where he says, test me. Try me out. Try me out.
SPEAKER 04 :
Okay. Because I think he's a reasoner and he's overwhelmed by that fierce thing going on. We're not going to have enough money.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, I tell you what, when you pray for your husband, buy him the spirit of fear.
SPEAKER 04 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, and bless him with peace and with righteousness.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, Pam.
SPEAKER 03 :
God bless you. God bless.
SPEAKER 06 :
We love you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Love you, too. Okay. Bye-bye.
SPEAKER 06 :
Let's talk to Seal and Greeley. How are you?
SPEAKER 03 :
I'm doing pretty good. Good. I've looked into you guys off and on for quite some time, but this is the first time I actually got through when you were actually there. Oh, well, good to know.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, we're glad you called.
SPEAKER 03 :
I was... I was listening, and I just came out of an appointment and heard you talking about going and getting a job somewhere else and getting out of the four walls. Right. I just wanted to share with you an experience that my husband and I had. We were living in Minnesota, and we were planning our vacation to northern Minnesota. And the night before we left, we really felt like the Lord was telling us to come to Colorado to visit his mother. And so the next day, instead of going to northern Minnesota, we came to Colorado. While we were here, we had been thinking we'd always wanted to move back here so he could be by his mom. And it's been, it was, I think, like 10 years. And while we were here, all of a sudden we thought, you know, Oh, let's see if there's jobs. And we were here for a week. During that week, I called on a job position, got a job. My husband went back, or we all went back. I quit my job that I had. and we moved to colorado did your husband get a job here too yes he did actually he came here on the promise of a job oh and um he didn't even know for sure if he'd get it or not um but if you trust that god is faithful and he is telling you that that's where you need to be um all it's going to work out exactly so has he taken care has he taken care of you Oh, yes. I mean, it did take time for my husband to get here because we had to sell our other home. But we had time to see each other like we met in between for a couple months. But the good thing was within two weeks of my husband getting here, Here, we bought a new home.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, praise God.
SPEAKER 03 :
And I think it was just the timing, because the people whose home that we bought had been thinking about selling their home, and so God wanted to place us in the place where we were.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
And He didn't want us to get a different home, so there were other things that had to fall in line. So it's really been wonderful.
SPEAKER 05 :
Good.
SPEAKER 03 :
We've been working and doing... Well, actually, now I'm a stay-at-home mom, so... God's blessing us tremendously because we listen.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes, that's right. And you obeyed. You did more than listen. Shema. That word Shema is in Deuteronomy 6.4. And it's a Hebrew word meaning listen with the intent of obeying. That's what you did. That's what you did.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, I was listening yesterday with Dr. Zodiati.
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
It was so wonderful. And I had always wanted a Hebrew-Greek study Bible. I had Dr. Sodiatis, and I gave it to my pastor because he'd always wanted one, and I just gave it to him as a gift.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, you blessed your pastor.
SPEAKER 03 :
So do you have one? No. Well, I got a cheap one, and it wasn't the same one. I didn't realize that. I thought I was getting the same one, and I don't like it as much, but... It'll work until I can get a different one.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, we'll pray that you get a Dr. Zodiani's Hebrew-Greek study.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes, thank you. Yes, I'm going to be looking for the New Testament one that he was talking about. The Greek one.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yes, the Greek one.
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, we were so honored to be able to interview a man of that stature on our show. I mean, that's like a dream for us. We've had his Bible for a number of years, and that was actually a rerun that we did on Monday. because we weren't able to get on the plane. All the planes were full coming back from Phoenix. So we did rerun that show, and so many people are blessed.
SPEAKER 03 :
Oh, I'm glad you did because I would have missed it because I didn't get to hear it before that.
SPEAKER 02 :
God bless you. Listen, if you're not on our mailing list and you haven't gotten a devotional from us this year, we'd be happy to send you one if you give John your name and address. Okay. All right. Wonderful.
SPEAKER 01 :
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER 02 :
Delightful call. It was great.
SPEAKER 06 :
Thanks, Celia.
SPEAKER 02 :
Bye now. Bye. Wow, what a great praise report. Yeah.
SPEAKER 06 :
Amen. It's important. Amen. I'll tell you, we have just about a minute to go. And folks, we want to tell you, we absolutely love doing these radio shows. And more than that, we love watching our listeners grow in the Lord. Yes.
SPEAKER 1 :
877-917-7256
SPEAKER 01 :
Call to Freedom is a listener-supported radio ministry. Barbara and her power partners invite you to come on board with us and become a network of hands holding up Call to Freedom ministry. Power partners support Call to Freedom with prayer and monthly financial support. You will be blessed supernaturally. We invite you to visit Call to Freedom's website, www.freedomstreet.org, where you can hear Barbara's daily radio broadcast 24 hours a day or order materials. You may share your praise reports and heart cries by mailing them to Call to Freedom, Box 370-367, Denver, Colorado, 80237. Or you may email us at barbracarmack at freedomstreet.org. Until next time, remember, Jesus loves you, Barbara loves you, and take joy.
SPEAKER 1 :
Thank you.
Listen as Dr. James Dobson and Mary Crowley discuss the challenges women face, such as low self-esteem and the quest for self-fulfillment in a world full of distractions. Mary emphasizes the importance of confidence and a supportive community, sharing insights on finding personal success beyond societal norms. Through personal anecdotes and scripture-based wisdom, this episode aims to inspire women to discover God's plan for them and to thrive in every area of life.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh. And whether you're listening at home or on the go, you are in for something special today. We are bringing you a classic conversation featuring Mary Crowley, author of the book Women Who Win, Who We'll be right back. $400 million in business, powered by thousands of women working from their homes. The company became so successful that when they held a celebration, they filled an arena with 10,000 of their top saleswomen, and they featured Bob Hope and Billy Graham as special guests. But Mary's secret wasn't just business savvy. It was putting priorities in the right order. Mary started every company meeting by reading Scripture, often turning to the Proverbs for wisdom about leadership. And here's an interesting connection. Mary Kay Ash, who co-founded Mary Kay Cosmetics with a similar home party business model, was actually Mary Crowley's sister-in-law. Now, in her book, Women Who Win, Mary addresses a challenge many women still face today, and that is a lack of self-confidence. Her message is both simple and powerful. You are designed for fulfillment, and God has a plan for your life. Mary Crowley believed that by honoring God and serving others, women could find success both at home and in business. So let's listen now as Mary talks about those timeless principles with our own Dr. James Dobson on this special edition of Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
I would like to say this is one of the most generous women I have ever met. She supports Christian causes all across this country. And your generosity is legendary, Mary. So you have taken what God has given you and shared it with so many causes that you believe in. But where did all that start? How did you get into business?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I got in business 27 years ago. Actually, I'd been in direct selling business before that, but now my kids were grown and I saw a need. There was a need for American women to decorate their homes with excitement and with care. And from a coordinated line of accessories, I found that women were not sure what to do. And I'd worked for furniture companies before. And so we started the business to give women an opportunity to work from their homes, be there when the kids got home from school, and still use their creative genius, which God gave every woman. Every woman is a genius. Some just don't know it yet or haven't developed yet. And this is the idea of the business, and we had twin goals. One was to honor God, because I knew by then that if we didn't honor Him, we would not be successful. Now, that doesn't mean that people who do not belong to the Lord, and there are lots of successful people, quote, in the world, they can be successful. But if I've made a profession of faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and my Master, that I cannot be successful if I do not honor Him. Somehow along the line, he'll let me fall flat on my face. And I've done that a few times, too. I believe that's true. Absolutely. So it had to honor him. And then it had to bless and serve people. The whole world wants service. They can buy products. They can buy merchandise. They can buy lots of things. but we want genuine, caring, personal service. And that was our goal, to do that. And in so doing, to help the woman who was showing and selling our accessories to find fulfillment in herself and to have a fellowship of her sisters. You know, America needs places where people can go to belong, to find a support team. When our great-grandmothers came across the prairies, They had quilting bees and canning bees, and they had support teams for one another in their difficult times and in their joyous times. So we have built support teams all across America. And the fellowship is as important as the salesmanship. And so that's how we started. We started from our garage, very, very small. My son and my daughter and myself and a few friends, people that invested and believed in us. And it's grown beyond my wildest imagination, and it's pretty wild.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let's address some comments to the woman who is at home, where you were when you started. I don't know what your circumstances were, but let's suppose that she feels somewhat unfulfilled and somewhat frustrated. She wants to do something significant with her life. Maybe the kids now are in the teen years, and she knows they're going to be gone before too long, and she's wondering what now. What do you say to her? How does she begin to put it all together and find out who she is? Does that necessarily mean she's got to be successful in business like you are in order to find yourself?
SPEAKER 02 :
No. Again, I come back to the measure of success for each person. Success is a moving target. When you've got little kids at home, sometimes it's just getting through the day. You know, and then as they go into school and you begin to have other time, and then it may be reading good books and getting yourself, your mind activated again. Maybe it's starting an exercise program, whatever it is, that the measure of success that makes you feel fulfilled, it's different for everybody. And each person has to learn to define their own. Otherwise, they are always trying to
SPEAKER 03 :
Why do you think that moving target is so difficult for American women to hit? Why do you think so many American women are frustrated?
SPEAKER 02 :
Because they are trying to find their measure of fulfillment in what they're hearing, either on TV or maybe radio or reading in some magazine, instead of trying to find out what God's game plan is for them. I heard a wonderful interview with Walter Payton not long ago, and he defined something that was so great. The interviewer asked him, is your measure of success 100 yards gained in a game, as is the measure of success for a ball game for a running back? And he said, no, my measure of success is following the game plan consistently. designed for that game to the very best of my ability. And I thought that was a wonderful way to illustrate what everybody, God has a game plan for my life, for your life, for every woman out there with little kids or big kids or no kids. And if somebody tried to just copy mine, they might get very frustrated. I have a high energy level, and I can do a lot of things. Others might not. We're all made differently. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
Could it be that God's game plan for a particular woman would be to stay home and take care of three little kids under six years of age for this period of her life? Society is telling her that that's nobody's game plan. Could that be God's game plan for some people?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, he says that in his word, and then he also says that older women should help the younger women. And I think this is where, again, I was talking about a support team. A lot of young women with little children are feeling so alienated and so unsupported because maybe her parents or his parents do not live close. Society has not built a support team around them in our today's world. that's where they need to find a support team. They have to have fellowship with other women, and maybe it's a Bible class, maybe it's a home interior show, maybe it's coming in part-time, or maybe it's simply finding other group of women who have uplifting, motivating things to do. put in their hours otherwise sometimes we do recruit mothers with young kids because she's sitting there watching the daytime dramas and living in a fantasy world and that is no good for her and so if we can enlighten her and lift her up and give her something to do part-time that will fulfill her desires and create you know we try to develop her creative talents women want to be accepted understood and developed They don't want to stay static. They want to be developed. So whatever. If you're sitting out there and you're thinking, well, I'm not being developed, then you find something that develops your mind, your spirit, your being. And don't sit there and get caught in that daytime drama trap of fantasy world. That's the worst thing.
SPEAKER 03 :
You're talking about soap opera.
SPEAKER 02 :
I am, I am. Well, that's terrible.
SPEAKER 03 :
It really is.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, but that's what happens to a lot of women who are home with little kids, Dr. Dobson. That's what happens to them. And so then just being at home with the children does not minister to their spirit or does not even help them to be good mothers unless they must have a plan to be a successful mother and a successful wife and woman.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, what do you say to the person who is very frustrated in their present job? Do you have any advice to a person who just feels they're in a dead-end trap? Change it. Absolutely. But it costs money. I'm making more money than I could make someplace else. Yeah, but it's not making you happy, so what good is it? But I've got to feed my family.
SPEAKER 02 :
Find another way to feed them. No, it isn't really worth it if people are frustrated in their jobs unless there is a real way that they can change the frustration in that job. If it's their attitude, then they better change the attitude. But if it's the job itself and there is no hope of fulfillment, then change the job. Life's too short and too wonderful to waste it on frustration. Now, we'll have frustrations in all jobs. People need to realize that. There are days of frustration in any job, and you can't expect a frustration-free job. But at the end of the day, there must be something that you feel that you've accomplished in the lives of other people. or in going forward in your measure of success or something that you have done that is an accomplishment at the end of every day. Oh, there'll be days you think, well, what did I accomplish today? I've just not even gotten through the mail. I didn't get through the dishes. I didn't get through there too many. You know, we live in the day of distractomania. But you can find something, some life that you touched, something that you did that made the doing worthwhile.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think you've put your finger on really the critical issue having to do with the support team. I've tried to write and talk about that because I find many women know they need that but don't know how to go and get it. I was counseling with a young mother just the other day in my office, and she said, I don't have anybody. I don't have any close friends. The one I had turned her back on me. And this is a very bright woman who's a schoolteacher and is very capable, very verbal, very able to get out and meet the world. Oh, I need to recruit her. And yet I find many women like that don't know how to take the first step. There is a lack of confidence perhaps to go outside that front door and maybe somebody will hurt me or reject me and it's just easier or seems easier to pull in and let the four walls collapse. I guess you're really addressing that problem.
SPEAKER 02 :
We do. We address that problem a great deal. And you hit it when you said lack of confidence. One time I took a poll all across America from thousands of women, asked them what were their three greatest problems personality-wise, society-wise, business-wise, or family-wise. And north, south, east, and west, there was no names on the papers. It was lack of self-confidence, low esteem. I was just floored. Here's the greatest nation in the earth, the highest educational level for all women, the greatest opportunities. So I set about my goal is to help every woman I meet or that hear the sound of my voice to feel better about herself, to realize you are designed for life. God has a plan for your life, but I fully believe that they cannot find it till they find that absolute, till they realize that God is their creator, he is their maker, and then they begin to understand what is the character of God. He loves, he cares, he's just, he's fair, he has great things for us. And once you find that, you see, people often say to me, well, haven't you been discriminated against as a woman? Well, maybe I just didn't have sense enough to know it. But you see, if somebody tries to put me down, it diminishes them, not me. My self-worth is tied up in the character of God himself. And once any woman finds that out, she's redeemed. She's free to be herself and then free to have the confidence to say to somebody, look, I need some help. I want to get to know some people. And how do you turn people with low self-esteem into good salespeople? Well, first of all, they have to learn what selling really is. They have an idea that selling is going out and talking and convincing people. No, it is not. True selling is serving a need in that person. And women are very good at understanding that once you find what this person needs and help them fill the need. Women are in the habit of filling needs of children, of husbands, of You know, they're nurturers by very nature. And once they realize that it's a natural for them to be able to find the need and to fill it and to help the person in a serving way, they realize that it isn't something big out there that they have to learn, but it's something that they already have, a natural opportunity. ability to do. We just need to develop that ability and help them see what it really is. It's a matter of learning what selling really is. Most people think of it as something that you talk and that you convince. No, it's finding out person to person what her needs and desires and likes are, what she needs in her life, what she needs in her home, and then I can help you find that. I can help you Express your love for your family on the wall or in the figurines or the way that you even arrange a bouquet of flowers. And women are natural nurturers and natural helpers in this area. So once she finds out that she already has the natural ability, we just help her develop it.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, my book, What Wives Wish Their Husbands Knew About Women, is based on this same thing we're talking about here, where I ask over 10,000 women to rank order the sources of depression in their lives. And it blew me away, too, that the number one source of depression in young, middle-class, seemingly happily married Christian women was low self-esteem, 50%. of the original test group that I based this little study on put that number one, and 80% put it in the top five. So this pervasive lack of confidence, lack of self-worth, is extremely widespread in our culture. And I think, again, it comes back to television to some degree, where every woman feels like she's got to be beautiful and young and successful and the object of somebody's great romantic love and attention in order to feel acceptable and to feel the confidence necessary to cope with life. And unfortunately, that support system just often isn't there.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, and not everybody is young and slim and gorgeous.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, unfortunately. What do you do, Mary, when you're looking eye to eye with a very powerful male corporate executive who has the authority to move great numbers of people and so on? You being a woman, do you look eye to eye with him?
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, absolutely. Oh, I thoroughly enjoy him. I'm on lots of boards where I'm the only woman. But I don't come in and try to be a pushy female. Let me be sure that I do say that. I am there to make a contribution, not to compete. And with that complete positive attitude, I never have any difficulty there. Because God made us to have special roles and special talents and special abilities. And I can greet and meet and deal with people Corporate executives are presidents. Well, that's now.
SPEAKER 03 :
You've got 39,000 people on your staff. What about when you had one? What about when you were beginning? Did you have that kind of confidence, or did it grow through the years?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, part of it has grown through the years, but I always had a lot of confidence. Well, the good Lord born me on April Fool's Day. That was wonderful, because most people worry about making a fool of themselves, and they won't do things that are going to make a fool. I didn't have to worry about that. You'd already gotten the title. I'd already gotten the title, yeah. So... But part of it comes from the fact that, well, my grandparents taught me to... place the bible as one of you know our priorities not long ago i gave a speech to young people and i took a tv guide and a bible with me and i held them up i said all of you have these two books in your home which one do you refer to the most next week dr alan redpath from england recently spoke and he said in england we used to base our morality on the bible now we base it on tv And I thought, you know, that's exactly what's happening in America, really. And so in looking at the Bible, God is who he says he is in his book. I am who he says I am in his book. And since he's who he is and I'm who he says I am, I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.
SPEAKER 03 :
Who does he say you are, Mary?
SPEAKER 02 :
He says that I am a child of his. If I believe in Jesus Christ, I'm joint heirs with him. Wow! Wow! What kind of a promise that is. And then, oh, you know, many, many places he says, you talk about giving. Over in Thessalonians where he says, if you will give and share that all grace will be given in all situations and all your needs will be met. Now, that is a pretty powerful promise. And I've been claiming those for years. Tithing to me is the secret of it. You see, what I can make is not for me to be hoarding. It's a channel. It's a channel. It's kind of like forgiveness. Forgiveness is not given to us in a cup. It's given to us in a pipeline. So what I receive is to be given. You can't out-give God. He just multiplies it. I am just amazed at Him.
SPEAKER 03 :
What do you say to the people who just feel like they can't tithe? Mary, they just can't pay their bills now, and they are $75 short every week, and just isn't enough to go around, and the kids need shoes, and there's a hole in the roof, and we're trying to put our oldest boy into Christian schools. How in the world am I going to give any money to the Lord's kingdom?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I go back to when I started tithing, and it was about 40 years ago. And I was in just that same situation. I had two kids. I was a single parent. I was raising two kids. The war was on. I was working for an insurance company. My income had not risen like other people's had. It was pledge time at the First Baptist Church in Dallas, and I always pledged and gave, but I didn't think I could tithe. So, particularly night, though, the kids were asleep, and I was wrestling with that, and I was telling the Lord all the reasons I could not tithe. Hmm. And I thought of that verse in Proverbs, you know, but is the Lord convinced? He speaks to us through our creative genius mind that he gives us. Well, Mary, you're not doing such a hot job of it yourself. Why don't you give me a chance? I said, okay, Lord, I check tithe. It's your problem. It's your management of my life. I'm going to bed. So then I had to explain to our housekeeper and the kids, you know, we had to take it out first because if you don't take it out first, it won't be there. And we ate oatmeal quite a bit there in the beginning, and some of them would grumble and everything. Something happens. I can't explain it. I don't understand God's mathematics. But within two months' time, I was able to get out of debt. Behind the eight ball wasn't debt per se, but just get caught up. From that day till this, we didn't suddenly have a lot of money. But something did happen. And I can guarantee that if you give God's management of your money, he has management of your life. Things change. It really is true. I cannot explain it. It really is true. I challenge people. I've challenged. I teach classes. I told you of people, 150 people single by death or divorced. A lot of them have aging parents and a lot of problems. I challenge them every year. I say, okay, you tithe for six months. And at the end of six months, if you're not better off than you are now, I'll pick up the tab for the difference.
SPEAKER 03 :
You just said that to three million people.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's right. And I have never yet anybody take me up on it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jesus spoke more about money than any other subject. So it must be extremely important to our spiritual welfare as well as to our financial welfare.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, it's exciting.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, we have a great deal of love for you, as I've said, for the kind of person you are, what you represent, not what you give, but who you are. You love the Lord, and it shows in everything that you do. And it's been a pleasure meeting your staff. Some of your people came with you today, and they're sitting in the gallery over there watching us broadcast today. And I just hope that you'll come back, continue doing the great work that you're doing. And I just trust the Lord will be very close to you in this coming year.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you. It's been a joy to be here. And I guess I would like to say to every person out there, trust Him, try Him, prove Him. He will never let you down.
SPEAKER 03 :
You really mean that?
SPEAKER 02 :
I really mean that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Have you found that true of your entire lifetime?
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. See, I've learned that Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. And I can absolutely say, without any doubt at all, if you really trust Him... He has a better plan for your life than you can have for yourself. And I am amazed at what he's done with one little orphan gal.
SPEAKER 03 :
Bless you, Mary. Our prayers and our thoughts will be with you. Thank you.
SPEAKER 01 :
Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. What a great thought to wrap up today's classic program featuring the late Mary Crowley here on Family Talk. Now, you've been listening to Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk and a timeless conversation between Dr. Dobson and his guest, Mary Crowley, about finding purpose, building confidence, and trusting God's plan for your life. Mary's remarkable journey from a single mother to building a multi-million dollar business, all while putting God first, continues to inspire women even today. By the way, if you missed any part of this classic program, or if you'd like to share it with someone who really needs a word of encouragement today, visit drjamesdobson.org, or you can find the program easily on the Family Talk app. Here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, we are committed to helping you and your family grow closer to God and each other. But these daily broadcasts and resources are only made possible through the generous support of friends like you who share our vision for strong, faith-filled families. Your tax-deductible donation today will help us continue broadcasting messages of hope and practical wisdom to millions of listeners in America and all over the world. To make a secure donation online, go to drjamesdobson.org. Or if you prefer, you can send your donation through the mail. Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, P.O. Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. And for more daily inspiration and biblical guidance, I encourage you to explore our reading plans in the Bible app by YouVersion. You can choose from 48 different plans, 24 on marriage and 24 on parenting. Each one contains three lessons to encourage growth in your relationships. These brief devotionals are perfect for busy parents or couples who want to grow together in their faith. Just open the Bible app on your phone or mobile device, search for Dr. James Dobson, and start your first reading plan today. Well, I'm Roger Marsh and from all of us here at Family Talk, we are so grateful that you've joined us for today's classic program. Be sure to join us again next time for another edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
In this episode of Through the Bible, we delve into the powerful teachings of the book of Hosea as Dr. J. Vernon McGee guides us through the trials of the Northern Kingdom of Israel. Ignoring God's word not only led to spiritual adultery but also brought about God's judgment in a dramatic and prophetic transition. As we reflect on the message shared by the evangelist D.L. Moody and stories from Dr. McGee's own ministry, we're prompted to consider the essential role of scripture in our everyday lives. Throughout Hosea chapter 4, we witness the consequences that befell Israel when they neglected their sacred texts. Dr. McGee draws parallels to modern times, illustrating how turning our backs on divine guidance can lead to moral decay and personal dissatisfaction. Whether through personal anecdotes or deep scriptural insights, this episode calls listeners to introspection and a return to God’s word. Join us as we uncover the inhibitors to spiritual fulfillment and the inevitable consequences of idolatry and sin. Whether you are a long-time believer, a part of our World Prayer Team, or someone in search of spiritual clarity, this study provides profound insights. Prepare to embark on this enlightening journey through Scripture with renewed understanding.
SPEAKER 1 :
The foundation, ye saints of the Lord, is laid for your faith.
SPEAKER 01 :
The evangelist D.L. Moody was right when he said, The Bible will keep you from sin, or sin will keep you from the Bible. Listening to and obeying God's Word is a protection over our lives. And that's one reason that I'm so glad that you're here at Through the Bible, ready to get into God's Word with Dr. J. Verna McGee. And as you know, we're in the book of Hosea on our five-year journey through the whole word. And in this study, we're going to learn how the northern kingdom of Israel turned away from God because they forgot his word. Well, not only did they forget it, they wanted nothing to do with it. They completely turned their backs on God's ways. And you know, that's when God's man Hosea stepped up and said, my people are destroyed for lack of knowledge of God's word. And then he relayed God's chilling consequence. Because you forgot the law of your God, I will also forget your children. I will change your glory into shame. Wow. I don't know about you, but that sobering pronouncement makes me sit up and listen. We're in Hosea chapter four. So as you open your Bible, let's listen to Dr. McGee's introduction on why God will judge his people.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now God says that he must judge the nation. And he says that he will change their glory into shame. Now the glory of Israel was actually the temple with the Shekinah glory upon it and his visible presence with the nation and his definite leading of them. And they're witness to the world of that day of monotheism. In a world of polytheism, they worship the living and the true God. That was their glory. It brought the Queen of Sheba from the ends of the earth. Now what is happening is this. God says, I will remove my glory from you. I'll remove my blessing from you. And I will judge you. I'll let the enemy come in upon you and take you away. And of course, the enemy is going to be able to say, look, they said they were God's chosen people. And look what's happening to them. And apparently their God's not a very strong God. Friends, we're seeing today in this land of ours something very similar to that. God is judging many churches and he's closing many doors today. You can look about you in this land of ours and see that God is still judging. And we are inclined to say, isn't it a shame to see a decline in a certain church? Well, maybe God closed the door. We need to recognize that only God today can afford to judge his own people, and he does that.
SPEAKER 01 :
Before jumping into our study, I invite you to join our World Prayer Team. Together we pray for listeners like Nora in the Philippines who writes this. I heard your message and want to know if you will really be forgiven. I have sinned in the past and I have thought that I am unforgivable. I got involved with another man and our entire village knows. I'm hurting and crying right now, but your words in my language of Locano comfort me and give me hope. For the first time, I feel as if God might accept me as I am. Please tell me what to do next. Please tell me more about Jesus and how I can be redeemed. Are you ready to join us for the journey? Well, hop aboard as we pray for millions of listeners like this one all over the world by signing up at ttb.org forward slash pray. And let's do that now. Thank you, Heavenly Father. Thank you for the privilege of hearing your word. Help us to turn what distracts us and do what pleases you. Thank you for allowing us to be a part of sharing your word with the world. In Jesus' name we pray. Amen. We're off to Hosea 4 on Through the Bible with Dr. J. Vernon McGee.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now, we got down last time through the sixth verse of the fourth chapter of Hosea. And again, I'd like to say that this sixth verse here of this fourth chapter is considered one of the most familiar verses that we have. It's one that is quoted a great deal. My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. And that's the way it opens. I went through it last time, and I'll not go any farther than that. But it was a lack of the knowledge of the Word of God that was the background of the sin of these people. The minute that Christian friend, you get away from the Word of God, you could not live a triumphant Christian life by any means. You could not live well-pleasing to the Lord. And I do not care how many of these method conferences you go to that have all these little gimmicks that if you do this and do that and do the other thing, that things are going to work all right for you in your home and in your place of business and in your social life, and everything will work out right. My friend, the Word of God makes it very clear that That's not by these little gimmicks, these little methods. It's by a knowledge of the Word of God. Now, that is as clear as the noonday sun in this book and certainly in other places. Now, will you notice as God continues to bring against the northern kingdom his judgment upon them, that is, he hands down a decision. He's going to judge them. And he has now proven that To them, his case, they broken the Ten Commandments. He went down the list and they had broken them. Now he says, as they were, verse 7, as they were increased, so they sinned against me. In other words, as the nation increased, God had promised to bless them by multiplying them. He told Abraham that. But all it did was just bring another sinner into the world. And after all, that's what happened when I came into the world. Just another sinner came into the world. But thank God, the grace of God reached down and somebody gave me the Word of God. And I was able to trust Christ as my Savior. But these people, they have an ignorance. They have no knowledge of the word of God. As they were increased, so they sinned against me. Therefore, will I change their glory into shame. God says, I'm going to turn your glory into shame. They eat up the sin of my people. They set their heart on their iniquity. They not only sin, but they like to brag about it. As a young fellow, ran with a pretty fast crowd in the bank I worked in. And we always like, especially on Monday morning, to brag about our weekend, what we did. And you know what it was, either to get drunk or... some adultery or something like that. That's what you brag about. And they not only sinned, they bragged about it. And there, verse 9 now, chapter 4 of Hosea, and there shall be like people, like priests. The unfortunate thing is that the priesthood had sunk down to the level of the congregation. Now, I have always believed, and as you've heard me say, that I started out in the ministry. I wore a Prince Albert coat and a wing collar. I look like a mule looking over a whitewash fence. But I soon gave that up. I dress just like the man sitting out in the pew. And I'm no different than that man in the pew. But I want to say this, that I want in the pulpit to give out the word of God so that I don't sink down to the level of that which is the man of the world. And today there are many ministers. They're the good guys. one man boasted to me he says you know he says my preacher says you know he says he comes out to our golf club he plays golf and i'm for that i do that i think it's great to mix with folk like that says after the game says he goes in the bar room with us has a drink with us says you know said he's just one of the fellas says i sure do like him well I wonder what God thinks about him. Like people, like priests. And I'll punish them for their ways and reward them for their doings, for they shall eat and not have enough. In other words, famine is coming to the land. And who would ever have believed that this great land of ours, just last year, a few years ago, that there would be no scarcity. Whoever heard of it, that you couldn't buy meat at the meat market, you couldn't buy bread, that there would be a scarcity of anything. May I say to you, I'm not sure. I think God judged us in the dust bowl many years ago. That's when I entered the ministry. And nobody listened to God then. Then we had to fight World War II. God judged us. And we didn't come back to God even World War II. So we've been fighting somewhere ever since. Just can't give it up. They shall eat, not have enough. They shall commit harlotry and shall not increase. You know, there's one thing, friends, about adultery. And I know today that I'm talking to a great many people that have had this in their mind and their heart because we're living in this day. And you can take it from a fellow that one time in his life before he's saved, you can never, never enjoy in a way in which God really wants you to until you can enjoy it in marriage. And when you can put your arms around the woman that you have been loving and you can say to her, I love you. above everything else in the world. Now, I say when you can say that, my friend, then there'll be an increase. And it'll be wonderful. Oh, they were committing adultery then, and they're doing it today. But actually, there's really no satisfaction in it. It's just a sort of a temporary release. And you hate yourself after that. And I know that. And some of you know that, my friend. And God knows that because that's what he's saying here. God's spelling it out for you. They shall eat and not have enough. They shall commit harlotry, adultery, and they shall not increase because they have ceased to take heed to the Lord. Harlotry and wine and new wine take away the heart. Last time we gave you all these statistics about liquor in this country today. And nobody, and I mean nobody today, is lifting a voice against this. And I don't think I've said very much about it. But I sure have said a whole lot the past couple of days. And from time to time, we do mention it. Arlatrin wine and new wine take away the heart, my friends. And part of our problem in Washington today are these two sins, harlotry, adultery, and liquor. They're the two problems in our government today. That's the reason that men lie. That's the reason that men will do crooked things. And that is not confined to one party or just one group. The whole crowd is guilty today. One writer said that in Washington, you don't know who to trust. May I say to you, what a sad commentary on our nation today. Don't tell me the new morality is working. It didn't work for Israel. They got away from the word of God and they said, we try something new. And they went in for it. The northern kingdom, you see, they had sin galore. They put up two golden calves. And with that worship of Baal, I was connected with it, the grossest forms of idolatry and the Verse 12, my people ask counsel of their idols, and their staff declareth unto them, for the spirit of harlotry hath caused them to err, and they have played the harlot departing from under their God. Now he's speaking here of the harlotry, spiritual adultery, which is turning from God. They went to inquire of idols. And today, we find people running after the gurus of India. Well, they haven't done much for India, by the way. But yet, we've had a crowd running after them. And someone has said that one of them that came over here, he said that very candidly, he came for the money. And that it was nothing in the world but a religious racket as far as he was concerned. Yet people went after him. People are going off into this type of thing today. And there's actually the worship of Satan today. I have here a clipping that comes from Daytona Beach, Florida. A group of Satan cultists tortured and beat a 17-year-old youth to death, believing he was an undercover narcotics agent, police said Wednesday. May I say to you that worship of Satan today is certainly not helping morality by any means. And these people going into idolatry, idolatry was leading them into gross immorality. Now, let me keep reading here. And They sacrifice, this is verse 13 now, chapter 4. They sacrifice upon the tops of the mountains and burn incense upon the hills under oaks and poplars and elms because the shadow of them is good. That's where they put their idols, was on top of a hill under a grove. And you hear a great deal in scripture. And they found out today, archaeologists, that the center of worship of idolatry was in these groves. It was cool there, nice place to go. Therefore, your daughters shall commit harlotry and your spouses shall commit adultery. You see, the worship of idols, and we today have turned to idolatry, covetousness, All of this today, the greed of this country today has caused many a family to try to get on in the world. They want to move to a better neighborhood. They want a swimming pool. They want a boat to take down. And they say we're doing this for their children. And then all of a sudden their children take off and there are thousands. Thousands of young people today that are wandering up and down this country and all over the world. I saw them in Hawaiian Islands. I talked to three young people in Constitution Square in Athens, Greece. Two young men and a young lady. And I'm sure that none of them were beyond their teens. One of them could have been 20. And there they sat, and they were then under the influence of drugs. I tried to talk with them, and I tried to find out who they were. And they said, we're nobody. We don't count. We've dropped out. What's happened today, friends? What's taking place today? Why, the problem is back there in the home. We're idolaters. We're worshiping the almighty dollar. We've forgotten God. We've turned away from the living and true God, and we no longer worship him. And we've not turned to a savior that can redeem us and help us. Now, verse 14. He says, I will not punish your daughters when they commit harlotry, nor your spouses when they commit adultery, for they themselves are separated with harlots, and they sacrifice with harlots. Therefore, the people that doth not understand shall fall. God says ignorance, so the law excuses no one. And because these people have gone on, I'm not going to judge them for the sin they're committing right now. I'm going to judge them because they've turned from the living and true God and from his way. My friend, as I said to a man, and I met him on a golf course, by the way, and he said, joined our foursome he soon left us when he found out we were three preachers and this man made a statement well he said that he guessed that he was a sinner he'd done this that and the other said yes I guess I'll go to hell and I said brother you know you're not going to hell because you commit these sins he says what do you mean I'm not going to hell because I thought that's what you preachers said I said this preacher never said that I said you're going to hell because you've rejected Jesus Christ These people were being judged not because they had become harlots. They were judged because they've turned from the living and true God. Now, will you notice he says here, though thou Israel play the harlot, yet let not Judah offend and come not ye unto Gilgal, neither go ye up to Beth-Avon or swear the Lord liveth. God says, I'm going to hold Judah back. I'll not judge Judah yet. And Judah, don't come up and worship these calves that they put up here. Now we come to something that's quite interesting. Verse 16. For Israel slideth back like a backsliding heifer. Now the Lord will feed them as a lamb in a large place. Now, friends, let's look at what really backsliding is. A great many people think backsliding means that you have become a Christian, joined the church, and then you drop back into sin, and that's backsliding. Now, may I say to you, that's not backsliding the way it's used here. And God illustrates it so you can't miss it. For Israel slideth back like a backsliding heifer. Now, I'm very happy the fact that as a boy, I had the privilege of living in the country and in a little town. And I think I've mentioned this before. There's a live next door to us in southern Oklahoma in a little town. We lived in a rancher. He had a big ranch and he had two boys and they were both about my age. And we three played together. We used to ride these heifers out in the lot and they would, you know, tie a rope around. As we said in that day, a belly band we'd put on them. We'd hold on to that. And then they'd buck us off. Now, every now and then, this rancher would load up. This was in the days before the automobile. In a wagon, he would load up these heifers to take them to market or take them out to the ranch. And he had a great big board. That is, it was a thing constructed out of boards that he put up at the back end of the wagon. It was a runway that you just try to run the heifer up back. Well, what they'd do, you'd put a rope around the heifer, and then you'd push her from the back. And as you'd get the heifer up, she'd go a part of the way, then she'd stiffen those front feet. She'd just put them out stiff. And you know what would happen? You couldn't pull her. She'd start sliding backwards. That's what backsliding is. Backsliding heifer. They were stiffening their front feet. And instead of being led of God, they were slipping backward all the time. And backsliding means when you turn your back on God and you step on that little neck of yours and that little mind of yours and you say, I'll have nothing to do with God. You're backsliding when you do that. You see, when you refuse to go the way God wants to lead you. Now he calls Israel here a backsliding heifer. There are a lot of backsliding heifers today and bulls also, by the way. Now, let me read the next verse. Ephraim is joined to idols, let him alone. Now, we come to another word here. The word backsliding is mentioned three times in this book, and you'll recall it's only Jeremiah and Hosea, and they spoke to a nation ready to go into captivity, accused them of doing this, refusing to be led of God, refusing to come to God. Now, Ephraim, that name occurs 36 times. He picks out one of the tribes of the 10 tribes in the north and applies it to all 10 of the tribes. And I frankly have never been able to figure out just how God uses that term. Is he using it in a way that is the term of endearment or is it a term of ridicule? Now, this time through Hosea, I've come to the conclusion that it's a term of endearment. It's a pet name. You see, Israel in the north had really no name as a nation. Judah in the south was really the nation. And these 10 tribes had revolted, you see. And now God gives them, I think, a pet name. And you'll find all the way through, it'll occur 36 times, Ephraim. And he says this in, I would say, a longing sort of way, but with a note of finality. He says here, Ephraim is joined to idols, let him alone. God says there comes a day in a man's life that if he keeps on being in a backslidden condition, refusing to listen to God, there'll come a day when God no longer can speak to that man. Now he says to them, your drink is sour. You'll become an alcoholic if you keep at it, brother. And it's not a disease. It's a sin. Their drink is sour. They have committed harlotry continually. Her rulers love shame more than glory. And the sad thing today is that we have men in government in high places instead of using a language that is clean. And chase. They love to cuss. And they love to drink. They love the shame more than glory. The wind hath bound her up in its wing. They're carried away by every wind of doctrine. And they shall be ashamed because of their sacrifices. God says, I'm going to make them ashamed before it's over with. Well, that brings us to the conclusion of chapter 4. Begin chapter 5 next time. Until then, may God richly bless you, my beloved.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, Dr. McGee convinced me of the joy and peace found in living a quiet, righteous life before the Lord. How about you? We're midway through our study in Hosea now, so if you'd like to share these studies with a family member or friend, they're available on our app or at ttb.org. Or to purchase our Bible bus flash drive that conveniently holds all of Dr. McGee's five-year messages and also includes all of his notes and outlines for our studies and more than 100 of his booklets, you Shop our online store at ttb.org or call us at 1-865-BIBLE. And while you're at ttb.org, check out our new softcover Bible companions for the New Testament. Again, that's ttb.org or 1-865-BIBLE. And when you call us, please tell us how you listen. Is it by app or online? Is it YouTube, your local Christian radio station? There are so many different options. And you know, by sharing this little bit of information, you help us to be good stewards of the resources that God has so graciously provided through faithful listeners like you. Now, as we break for the weekend, join me for Dr. McGee's Sunday sermon. You can listen by app, online, or look at our radio station listing at ttb.org. I'm Steve Schwetz, and I'll meet you right back here next time as we continue to make our way through the Bible.
SPEAKER 02 :
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