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The conversation takes a poignant turn as Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu’s passionate outcry against Hamas atrocities is highlighted. Grappling with complex geopolitical strains, Governor Israel Ganz shares the latest in Israel, underlining the dire need for international support and solutions. As the dialogue transitions to domestic issues, President Trump’s recent executive orders aiming for governmental efficiency and constitutional adherence come under scrutiny. Legal expert Donald Cochin provides insights into the potential impacts and execution of these legal directives, offering listeners critical perspectives on navigating America’s evolving political landscape.
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from the heart of our nation’s capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation’s leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview. Sitting in for Tony is today’s host, Jody Heiss.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, good afternoon. Welcome to this Friday edition of Washington Watch. I am your Friday host, Jody Heiss, the Senior Vice President here at the Family Research Council and President of FRC Action. Thank you so much for joining us today. We’ve got a lot coming your way. Here’s some of the highlights. After a 12-hour voterama, as it’s known, it went well past midnight. Senate Republicans finally passed their budget resolution on a party-line vote.
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In this vote, the yeas are 52, the nays are 48. The concurrent resolution, as amended, is considered agreed to.
SPEAKER 04 :
I’m sure all of you stayed up last night, this morning, around 1.45 to hear that announcement from the Senate President Pro Tem Kevin Cramer. He was announcing the results of the vote. Well, now Senate Republicans say that their budget resolution is Plan B. Well, what is Plan A? Well, that would be the House version, the version that President Trump is preferring. So looking forward, how is all this going to unfold? Is it going to be plan A or plan B? I’ll be discussing that here in just a moment with Congressman Ron Estes of Kansas. In outrage over the discovery yesterday after Hamas returned the bodies of four Israeli hostages, the Bibas children, Ariel and Kafir, they died at the hands of Hamas. And then the body of the woman that was returned was not that of their mother.
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Who kidnaps a little boy and a baby and murders them? Monsters, that’s who. These Hamas monsters also cynically refused to bring back the boy’s mother, Shiri, and sent the body of a Gazan woman instead in brazen violation of the agreement.
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That, of course, was Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu earlier today. And I’ll be discussing this and other developments when I’m joined later in the program by Yisrael Ganz. He’s the governor of the Binyamin region and chairman of the Yesha Council. And then, this past Wednesday, President Trump signed an executive order that will require federal agencies to evaluate all their regulations that could violate the Constitution. And amazingly, or maybe not so amazingly, the left is upset. Why? We’ll be discussing this a little bit later with law professor Donald Cochin. He’s the executive director of the Law and Economics Center at George Mason University. And then here’s something that is refreshing to hear.
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Our cultural message is, I think that it wants to turn everybody, whether male or female, into androgynous idiots who think the same, talk the same, and act the same. We actually think God made male and female for a purpose.
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Wow. Well, of course, that was Vice President J.D. Vance. He was speaking yesterday at the Conservative Political Action Conference, also known as CPAC. I’ll discuss this and other trending news items when I’m joined later in the program by David Claussen for our weekly Biblical Worldview segment. So as always, we’ve got a lot to unpack for you today. If you miss any part of it, please keep handy our website, TonyPerkins.com. All right, now for our first news item for the day. It was early, early, early this morning, but the Senate passed the Republicans’ budget plan on largely a party-line vote. That’s teeing up some key elements of President Trump’s domestic agenda. All this is happening despite President Trump’s stated preference for the House budget plan over the Senate’s. So will the House or the Senate plan end up winning the day? Well, joining me now with all the latest is Congressman Ron Estes. He’s a member of the House Ways and Means Committee as well as the Budget Committee and the Joint Economic Committee. He represents the fourth congressional district of the great state of Kansas. Congressman Estes, welcome back to Washington Watch. Great to see you, my friend.
SPEAKER 19 :
It’s great to see you, Jody. Thanks for having me on.
SPEAKER 04 :
You bet. All right. So now the Senate has passed their version. So what’s the latest on all the budget reconciliation process, especially on your side of the Capitol?
SPEAKER 19 :
Yeah, it was good that the Senate passed their version last night, but it’s really not what we need to proceed forward with. I mean, they did a pared down version that only addressed border security and some defense of the nation. And it doesn’t do anything to address some of the other important things that we included in our House resolution that we passed last week. I mean, we looked at and included in our resolution, not just supporting border security and improving our national defense, But also, how do we make sure that we don’t get a 22% tax increase for Americans next year? Making sure that we have pro-growth energy policies and economic policies in our bill. And we also address the deficit. I mean, that’s a piece that we put charges out there for our committees to go look at dollar amounts to actually reduce the deficit. And that’s becoming a bigger and bigger issue now as we have $36 trillion in debt, which is which is over $106,000 per individual American across the country. And it’s increasing every year by about $2 trillion, thanks to all the spending that’s been included over the last several years since COVID. We think that having the bill that addresses all of these issues, there’s something that we can focus on now, provides a good value for the country as opposed to spending now and then kicking the can down the road to address the taxes or address the deficit in the future, which is what the Senate’s version does.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, you know, kicking the can down the road seems to be a standard, has become, unfortunately, a standard operating procedure, it seems like, for the last many years. So really glad to see the potential of this changing. And the House version, as the president refers to it, one big, beautiful bill. It kind of covers all of it, like you were just suggesting. And that really is what we need. So let me just throw this out to you. Yesterday actually marked one month since President Trump returned to the White House, breakneck speed he’s been operating. Give me, how would you grade him so far on his second administration? How’s it going so far?
SPEAKER 19 :
It really has been breakneck speed. You look at all the things that the president’s doing, the things that he talked about during the campaign that he wanted to focus on, the things that we talked about during our re-elections for the House as well as the Senate, is how do we limit the government? How do we downsize some of this excessive spending that’s out there? How do we make sure that we have good policies in place that actually support the American people, that protect our borders? that help make sure our defense is supported, our men and women and servicemen and women. And President Trump’s hit the ground running. It’s hard to think that it’s only 30 days ago that the president came in on board and focused on what was going on. We’ve had the Doge group that’s out there working now under the auspices of what was created. Back during the Obama administration, the agency was created. President Trump renamed it and actually is using that technology to go out and sort out waste and fraud and abuse and improper payments. We’ve seen a whole lot of reporting out of USAID and some of the issues there. Some of the stupid things that money was being spent on in those areas and supporting the Sesame Street program for Iran or supporting DEI initiatives and Burma and other countries and paying for electric vehicles in Vietnam. And these are things that, you know, American are now being on the hook to the money that’s been borrowed to actually pay for these things. So it’s uncovered a lot. I’m chairman of the Social Security Subcommittee on Ways and Means this term. One of the things I’m keeping a very close eye on is some of the information that they’ve brought out of Social Security. Obviously, we don’t want to be making improper payments. We want to make sure that the money’s there so that the people that are entitled to Social Security can receive their benefits. And we make sure that we want to fix the system, make sure that it It endures into the future for not just current retirees, but also current workers so that it’s there when they retire as well. So we’re working hand in glove to help make sure that we can address all of these issues and at the same time move our country forward, make sure that we keep our economy going strong.
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Congressman Estes, that’s just stunning to me, so much of what you just shared, so much. And, you know, when you look at just 30 days, as you said, since this president has been here, I’ve had people tell me on more than one occasion, several occasions, people have said this president has done more in a month than most presidents do in an entire term. And I don’t know if that’s fully accurate or not, but it sure seems that way. He and Congress, everybody is just moving at an incredible pace. And rightfully so, there’s so much to be done. And one of the things, as you just mentioned, is DOGE, this Government Office for Efficiency. Why in the world has it become controversial to demand that the federal government be good stewards of taxpayers’ money, of our money. How can that possibly be controversial?
SPEAKER 19 :
Yeah, it really does reflect on the thought process in Washington for so many years is that just create a government program and then expect that it lasts forever and that it’s going to continue to grow, that more money is going to be put into it. And once you start unpeeling what really is happening. Do we really need to be doing that? People complain because they’re living off of the money that’s being borrowed to pay them to line their pockets. And so there’s so much out there that’s being uncovered through this process. We need to make sure that we continue that effort Even presidents in the past have talked about making sure that we eliminate fraud and abuse, and yet nothing’s been done about it in the past. When the general accounting office or the inspector generals had identified areas, nothing was really done. during the Biden administration, the general accounting office identified somewhere between 230 and 525 billion dollars in fraudulent payments that they estimated were happening and nothing was done to fix that. And it’s great that President Trump’s come in and we’ve got the Doge group working to identify that and to stop that.
SPEAKER 04 :
You actually have a new op-ed that’s talking about this whole thing of reining in reckless spending. Real quickly, tell us about that.
SPEAKER 19 :
Yeah, we wanted to make sure that we help to support the Doge Group in the effort that they’re looking at in terms of making sure that we root out this improper payments, fraud, waste. We wanted to make sure that there’s no reason that a government program should exist forever. We need to be smart. We need to look and analyze whether things are successful, whether programs are currently working the way they were designed to work. Obviously, there’s a role for government. We wanna make sure that as Republicans, we wanna make sure it’s a limited role, but we also wanna make sure that it’s effective and efficient in terms of what it does. And so that’s why it’s so important that we analyze and we don’t shy away from Sometimes it’s making tough decisions about whether something is making sense now in the 21st century that may have been created 50 years ago, may have made sense then, but doesn’t make as much now that we have the internet, now that we have new technology out there to help us get things done.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you so much, Congressman Ron Estes from Kansas. Wow, you guys have a lot of plates spinning right now. And by the way, we’re going to put your column up. For those watching and listening, you can find Congressman Estes’ column, his op-ed. We’re going to put it up on TonyPerkins.com under today’s resources. So be sure to go check that out. Congressman Estes, Godspeed to you. Thank you, my friend. Appreciate you joining us.
SPEAKER 19 :
Great. Thank you, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
All righty. All right. Stay tuned. We’ve got much, much more coming your way on the other side of the break. I’m going to be joined by Governor Israel Gantz. He’s the chairman of the Yesha Council. So much is happening in Israel right now among some heartbreaking news as well. So stay tuned. Much more coming your way right after the break.
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During these challenging times for our nation, Family Research Council continues to serve as a watchman on the wall for faith, family, and freedom. And together, thanks to your support, we’re making an eternal impact. 2024 was a year of shining the light for biblical truth in Washington, DC. Last fall, over 1,000 spiritually active, governance-engaged conservatives gathered for the Pray, Vote, Stand Summit to pray for our nation and ensure that the issues impacting sage cons were understood and advanced. Washington Watch with Tony Perkins marked a major milestone this year, its 900th episode, and added the Washington Watch News Desk, a new production that presents the top news each day from a biblical worldview. The Washington stand published 2,000 articles of news, commentary, and podcasts in 2024, garnering over five million views. FRC’s outlet for news and commentary continues to pursue the truth on the issues that matter most to you and your family. And with the launch of the Stand Firm app, you can listen to, watch, and read our content in one simple place. Pray for current issues, stay rooted in the scriptures, and engage the political sphere with the community of believers on our new platform. In 2024, FRC shaped public policy and culture, organizing the National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance where members of Congress and Christian leaders came together to seek God’s intervention in America. In May, FRC called upon believers to pray for and stand with Israel by dedicating a portion of their worship services to pray for Israel’s peace, prosperity, and protection. With Pray, Vote, Stand Decision 2024, FRC and Real Life Network led a powerful evening of election night coverage to analyze the election results and pray that our nation would turn back to God. We also filmed a transformative educational course, God and Government. Available now on the Stand Firm app, this series will explore the biblical and historical foundations of our government, empowering you to stand confidently in your role as a citizen of heaven and earth. Family Research Council thanks you for partnering with us in standing for faith, family, and freedom.
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Welcome back to Washington Watch. Glad to have you joining us today. All right, earlier today, the Israeli military announced that it had positively identified the remains of Kafir and Ariel Bibas. But sadly, their mother, Sheree, who also perished while in the Hamas hands of the captivity, well, she was not actually among the bodies that were returned to Israel. And that, of course, was contrary to what the terror group claimed. And compounding all of the grief that the nation of Israel right now is experiencing. We now have also a series of intentional bus explosions that took place in the Tel Aviv area. So there’s just so much pain, so much heartbreak in that nation right now, and so much for us to be praying for. Well, here to unpack these horrific stories is Israel Ganz. He’s the governor of the Binyamin region and chairman of the Yesha Council. Governor Ganz, welcome to Washington Watch. I’m so sorry that it’s under these particular circumstances.
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Thank you for having me. And thank you for your hug and your partnership with what we are facing, the challenges in the state of Israel. And we really feel your prayers and your hug.
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Well, you absolutely have them, and they will continue. And I do just begin by expressing deepest and most heartfelt sympathy and condolences for you and your nation during this incredible time. So if you can, bring us up to speed. What do we know regarding the body that Hamas claimed was Sheree Beavis?
SPEAKER 14 :
So what we know right now that Shari is missing, I just got a message that of Hamas sources. I can’t say that it’s truth. Hamas said that now they found her body and they will bring it to us. But I can’t say that it’s real truth. For me, it’s a reminder for whom we are dealing with. We are dealing with, I can’t say anymore, so cruel people that murder children by their hand, by their hand. That’s what we found in an investigation about months after had been kidnapped. You know, it’s not for human being. And those people, we saw when they brought the bodies back, we saw the crowd celebrating and happy. We can’t. We can live with that hate, with that cruel. We have to fight and defeat the terror because it’s in ideological ideas that we not share the same ideas and we have to fight with them.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely. And there’s all sorts of false accusations that they’re putting forth as well, such as the accusation from Hamas that the Biba’s children actually died as a result of the IDF’s heroic efforts to save them. So what do you have to say in response to that?
SPEAKER 14 :
So, in fact, we check that, and the facts are that Hamas murdered the children, but more of that. You know, when Hamas talk about civilian people, civilians that had been kidnapped and had been murdered in Gaza, how can you take children, civilians, as in hostages? on your way and trying to release your terrorists. You cannot compare between terrorists and children. And for me, the fact that we give out for terrorists, we give them terrorists for bodies of children. It’s unbelievable. We are not allowed to do that. We have to fight the terror. Otherwise, they can attack civilians all over the world and take some hostages, and they can ask to release terrorists if we want the civilians back. We are not allowed to agree with that. And I want to add something. I am the governor of Judea and Samaria. You know, 86% of the Arab population The Cleveland, Judea, and Samaria on October 8 voted that they support Hamas massacre. We just say yesterday is a miracle. God stayed with us. Miracle, three buses had been exploded with bombs inside, and we found more free bombs. And God help us. And it’s bomb, it had been exploded while the buses were empty. God help us, but we have, he wants us to fight. And he asked us, why are they the terrorists in Judea and Samaria? As you see the view behind me, it’s a picture of Shiloh Valley from the place of Joshua came and built his tabernacle. Now, in a CPACA two days ago, they made a resolution that called President Trump to apply a sovereignty over Judea and Samaria, Israel’s sovereignty, to declare for everyone in the world that the whole state of Israel, including Judea and Samaria, it’s a part of the state of Israel and it belongs to the people of Israel. I think that when we will say it clear, Iran and its proxies will understand that they have no any chance to make us give up and to remove us from the Holy Land.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely. So, yeah, I’m glad you brought that up. And as you mentioned with the attacks, fortunately, the buses were empty and totally agree God is working in behalf of you. But do we know who the perpetrators were in the in the recent bombings and how is that going to impact the ceasefire and the hostage deal to this point? We’ve only got about a minute or so left.
SPEAKER 14 :
So we found some footsteps that it’s belong to terrorists from Tulkarem, from Judea and Samaria. In fact, we called a more battalion to come to Judea and Samaria and to help in security. Judea and Samaria to prevent 2nd October 7th that can come every single day or hour from Judea and Samaria for the whole entire state of Israel. We have to prevent that. So yesterday, they called one more battalion to be in Judea and Samaria. And we’re trying to find the terrorists. But it’s not only the terrorists. It’s their bases, where they’re manufactured, that they produce their bombs. And we have to fight them.
SPEAKER 04 :
They absolutely have to fight them. I want to thank you, Governor Israel Gans. I want to just rest assured you that our audience and our nation is behind you. And I know this audience 100 percent. behind you as you seek to eradicate this evil. I want to thank you for your leadership. Thank you for taking time to join us today on Washington Watch. Godspeed to you, my friend.
SPEAKER 14 :
Thank you so much. And I want to ask you to pray. My sons are right now fighting in the army with all the soldiers. We all pray for them. And thank you for your prayer. And I want to promise you, we will be on behalf of all the people strong in Judea and Samaria and the state of Israel.
SPEAKER 04 :
Good deal.
SPEAKER 14 :
I’ve got to go.
SPEAKER 04 :
I’ve got to go. Much more coming your way on the other side of the break. Stay tuned.
SPEAKER 15 :
Oh, beautiful for spacious skies, for amber waves of grain.
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At the 2025 National Gathering for Prayer and Repentance, hundreds gathered with Christian and government leaders at the Museum of the Bible in Washington, DC, to pray for the nation and ask God to forgive us of our sins.
SPEAKER 03 :
We gather here not to appeal to 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. We are appealing to heaven. Today we make our appeal not in the authority of a political party or in the name of a denomination. We come in the name and the authority of Jesus Christ. who has been given all authority in heaven and on earth, and we have been commissioned to operate in that authority.
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Father, we pray in Jesus’ name for our complacency, our greed, our pride, our gluttony, our sloth, and tolerance of sin.
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Lord, your word is the food that can make America healthy again. May your word be exalted and believed in our nation again.
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Lord, we ask that you allow us to become that shining city on the hill once more for your love, your grace, and your mercy.
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thank you for your love and your grace and your mercy, for the opportunity that you have provided us to heal our land. We ask you to do it, Lord. We ask you for the wisdom, discernment, and stamina to do the thing that you have called each one of us, all of us here, to do. May we be found faithful. We trust it, pray it, believe it all in Jesus’ name. Amen.
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Welcome back to Washington Watch. So glad to have you joining us today. Happy Friday to you. All right. It’s only been one month and a day since President Trump moved back into the White House. But boy, has he ever hit the ground running or what? Most especially, I think, we would all look at the Department of Government Efficiency, also known as DOGE. This past Wednesday, the president signed a new executive order. Now catch this one. Ensuring lawful governance and implementing the president’s Department of Government Efficiency deregulatory initiative. That is a mouthful. But what does this executive order cover? Is it a good one? Well, joining me now to discuss this is Dr. Donald Cochin. He is a professor of law and the executive director of the Law and Economics Center at George Mason University’s Antonin Scalia Law School. Professor Cochin, welcome to Washington Watch. It’s an honor to have you. Thank you for having me, Congressman. It’s a pleasure to be here. Well, listen, you’ve read this executive order. It’s a mouthful, just the title of it all. But what’s your assessment of it? What is this thing going to do specifically?
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This is an executive order which really is at the heart of what executive orders are intended to be. That is, it focuses on instructing agencies to get their house in order. And what it really means is that every agency is required to do a review of the constitutionality and the consistency with statutory authority of all of their regulations and basically check and see, you know, check under the hood and make figure out whether or not you’ve been driving a lawful agency or not, or whether or not there’s a lot of junk in there that needs to be removed.
SPEAKER 04 :
I love this. I just think this is an outstanding executive order. And as you brought up, so aptly, this is what executive orders are supposed to do. So what are you anticipating? I mean, we’re going to look under the hood, as you say. We’re going to see how these regulations and so forth within various agencies, how they measure up to the Constitution. What are you expecting to find under the hood?
SPEAKER 09 :
I think we’re going to find a lot of regulations that simply do not comply with both their statutory and constitutional limits. And the reason why is because we’ve been operating under a regime in the administrative state for a long time, a presidential regime, which allowed for high deference to agency interpretations of their own authority. This kind of deference, which had been known as Chevron deference, was eliminated by the Supreme Court’s decision in Loperbright last year. And that decision in and of itself says that now judges have a duty, a judicial duty to interpret what the statutes mean that authorize agencies to act rather than asking, hey, agency, are you authorized to act? Because the incentives for the agency. are to, of course, justify their own authority. So for decades, we’ve been operating under this self-perpetuating set of precedents that allow agencies to justify their own interpretation of their underlying statutes. So what we’re going to see now is that agencies, in light of these new precedents, are going to have to take the precedent seriously. There’s a few that come into play. One is that Loperbright decision, which eliminated the deference to agency interpretations of their own authority. Another is a case called Cornerpost, which was also decided the same term, which said if you’re harmed, if you’re aggrieved by an agency action, you get to sue the agency and make a facial challenge to the agency’s rules even years after that rulemaking occurred. Why? Because you didn’t know that it was going to affect you until you’re actually aggrieved. So the U.S. Supreme Court ruled reinterpreted what it means to have a statute of limitations under this, which opens up a lot of agency regulations to, in fact, challenge now. And then there’s a slew of other cases, including the very important West Virginia versus EPA, which was a decision which has become known as announcing or and it didn’t really announce, but it just sort of clarified what’s called the major questions doctrine. And this one says that if agencies want to do things that touch on significant issues that impact the economy or society, then the courts are going to presume that Congress would have needed to legislate in a very clear manner to give the agency that authority. If there’s not clear authority, we’re not going to let the agency go and grab it. The SEC can’t come in and say, actually, they are climate regulators, when there’s nothing about securities regulation that deals with the climate. So this kind of major questions doctrine in West Virginia versus the APA makes a lot of regulations susceptible to new challenges as well as being beyond what Congress has authorized. What’s nice about this executive order, and then I’ll turn back to you, is also that it also asks the agencies to look at not only beyond the major questions doctrine, but also look and determine whether or not You were delegated authority that was unconstitutionally delegated to you. In other words, Congress makes the laws, not the administrative agencies. If it’s too vague or too ambiguous and you’re essentially making laws in an agency, you can’t do that. Wow. We’ve only got about a minute left.
SPEAKER 04 :
What is in this executive order that will help it be implemented throughout the federal government?
SPEAKER 09 :
So every agency now has to catalog all of their regulations into and determine whether or not they fit any of the categories of concern. And that’s in the first section of the executive order. And that catalog has to be done within the next 60 days. So like with everything else that’s happening right now, we’re in rapid action mode. And so every agency has to determine whether or not every existing regulation is within their statutory authority, according to how the statutory authority would be interpreted by court. What’s nice is that the executive order says the best interpretation of your statutory authority, which requires that the agencies look at, well, what would the court say? And after that 60 days, then they have to go through and look at how to cleanse their house of the bad stuff.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely amazing. This is one of those executive orders that we may not have ever thought of, but it’s the one we’ve all been waiting on. Absolutely fascinating. Professor Cochin, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you for breaking this down for us. We appreciate your time so much. Thank you for highlighting this issue. Take care. All right, have a great weekend. All right, friends, don’t go anywhere. We’ve got much, much more coming your way, not the least of which I’m going to save part of it to tell you when we come back from the break. But when we come back, David Claussen is going to join me for our weekly Biblical Worldview segment. You don’t want to miss it. We’ve got a lot to talk about. So stay tuned. Much more coming your way right after the break.
SPEAKER 10 :
What is God’s role in government? What does the separation of church and state really mean? And how does morality shape a nation? President John Adams said our Constitution was made only for moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. Join Family Research Council for God and Government, a powerful 13-part series that equips you with biblical truth to engage in today’s most pressing debates, from the Ten Commandments in classrooms to the immigration crisis of America. will uncover the foundations of our nation’s history and why it’s relevant for today. Defend God’s plan for government because faith and freedom were never meant to be separate. New episodes available each Monday. To view the series on the Stand Firm app, text COURSE to 67742.
SPEAKER 11 :
The world is hurting, streets are filled with crime, families are broken, sin is celebrated, and God is mocked. Everywhere we look, the wages of our sin are on full display. As Christians, we know that surrender to God’s will is the solution to our biggest problems, but not everyone agrees. Even in church, we hear people say the most important thing is to be tolerant, that we shouldn’t impose a morality on other people, and that loving our neighbor means celebrating what they do. But you can’t do that. It’s not that you don’t love your neighbor. You do. But you care about God’s opinion more than your neighbor’s opinion. And this makes you different. In fact, sometimes it makes you feel alone, like you’re the only one. But there is good news. You are not alone, not even close. Research has found that there are 59 million American adults who are a lot like you. There are millions of people around the country who are born again, deeply committed to practicing their faith, and believe the Bible is the reliable word of God. But that’s not all. They’re also engaged in our government. They’re voters. They’re more likely to be involved in their community, and they’re making a difference in elections. The problem is that a lot of them feel alone, too. We want to change that. FRC wants to connect these 59 million Americans to speak the truth together, no matter the cost. If you want to learn more about this group and what it means to be a spiritually active, governance-engaged conservative, or if you want to find out if you are one of these sage cons yourself, go to frc.org slash sagecon and take the quiz to find out. The world is hurting, and we have the solution. We can’t do it alone, but we can do it if we work together. That’s what we’re working toward every day. Join us. Go to FRC.org slash S-A-G-E-C-O-N, SageCon, to learn more. That’s S-A-G-E-C-O-N, SageCon, to learn more.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you so much for joining us today on Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss, your Friday host. Glad to have you with us. All right, before I get to my next guest, I want to encourage each of you viewers and listeners of Washington Watch to take advantage of a 40% discount off of a brand new book that’s about to be released. We all love discounts, and now is your opportunity, listeners and viewers of this program. FRC’s very own David Claussen. has written a new book entitled Life After Roe, Equipping Christians for the Fight for Life Today. The book is the first major book about abortion to be published since the overturning of Roe v. Wade. And specifically, now catch this, the book looks at the life issue from a theological perspective. A biblical, a historical, and a political perspective. All of that wrapped up in one. And listeners, viewers of Washington Watch can use the discount code Washington Watch to receive a 40% off discount. That’s Washington Watch without any spaces. One word, Washington Watch. Go to LifeWay.com. and enter that code to get 40% off this resource. I received my copy this week, and trust me, you’re going to want to eat this thing up. So be sure to get that with your special discount Washington Watch. All right, it’s been another news-packed week in Washington and around the country, around the world for that matter. And as always, we’d love to end the program by thinking about the headlines through a biblical worldview lens. And joining me now to talk about some of the headlines is David Claussen, of course, the director of the Center for Biblical Worldview here at FRC. David, welcome back to Washington Watch. Happy Friday.
SPEAKER 06 :
Great to be with you, Jody.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right, before we started, we got to talk about your book. Thank you. What a powerful book. This is not only the lead-in to this segment, but this is a very timely book, and I know you’re excited about it. Let me just start by asking you about the title, Life After Robe. What’s the life issue look like now, two and a half years since we’ve had the Dobbs decision?
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, Jody, that’s such a big question. It’s actually one of the reasons I wrote the book. In fact, here at FRC, here in our DC headquarters, we have a group of really bright political science students from Calvin University. Just spent some time meeting with them, and we talked about this very issue. And two and a half years removed from Roe v. Wade being overturned, I think we are at a crossroads, really, when it comes to the life issue. Justice Alito, in that majority opinion, said that the question of life pertains to policy, is returned to the American people and their elected representatives. And so we’re seeing, I think there’s a federal role, I obviously think there’s a state role, and we’re seeing this played out all over the country. We’ve seen since Roe was overturned, Jody, some states becoming more aggressive in protecting life, others are becoming more pro-abortion. And so I think we’re at an important moment, Jody, and I think for Christians, this is a moment. Again, Roe v. Wade, getting that overturned, that was never the ultimate goal. The ultimate goal is seeing a culture of life established in this country, and that’s going to start in every family, every community, and every church across this country.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, I don’t think that this book could be more timely than right now, David. So I just want to say thank you for writing it. Congratulations on finally this time coming for it to be released. And I just pray that millions will read this and take it to heart. As we look at some of the other events that have taken place this week, one of the most significant stories, as it relates specifically to the issue of life, is President Trump’s executive order on IVF. Of course, at FRC, we’ve had a lot of discussion about this this week. In fact, our president, Tony Perkins, released a statement. I’d encourage all our viewers to check that out. But David, now that we’ve had some more time to kind of digest this executive order, I’m wondering about your perspective. Tell us what you think about this executive order on IVF.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, Jody, I think it’s important to be clear about what the executive order does and what it does not do. The executive order, as it is written, does not prescribe specific policies. In fact, Jody, it asks for policy recommendations with the goal that IVF would become, that access would be easier and that it would reduce cost. It simply makes the point that IVF in this country is very expensive. A single cycle can cost upwards of $12,000. What I do like about the executive order, Jody, is kind of in the beginning where there’s an aspiration that I think Christians can confirm or affirm. And let me just read this line. This is from President Trump. And I think this is, again, should be applauded. This is what the president says. He says, my administration recognizes the importance of family formation, And then he goes on to say, and as a nation, our public policy must make it easier for loving and longing mothers and fathers to have children. Well, Jody, praise God that we have a White House that is looking to strengthen and support the family. That’s a deeply biblical impulse. Psalm 127.5 talks about blessed is the man whose quiver is full. And so I think, Jody, what we need to look at is, you know, this is a… president who campaigned on expanding IVF. And again, you know the mantra here in DC over the last couple weeks, promises made, promises kept. So it’s no surprise that President Trump is trying to move on this issue. But I think at this point, it’s a wait and see approach. And this is an opportunity, I think, for groups like the Family Research Council and many of our allied organizations to engage in this conversation on what would good public policy look like surrounding artificial reproductive technologies, including IVF. I think this is an opening of a conversation that I think Christians should welcome.
SPEAKER 04 :
I recognize this is a wait and see moment, but this is, as you alluded to, this is also a moment where individuals and organizations such as FRC need to speak into this situation. It’s certainly my opinion, and I believe you probably share this belief, that I don’t think many Christians really have seriously given much thought about the ethical implications of IVF. I mean, we all know that children are a blessing of the Lord and IVF is seen as a means to that end. I mean, we get that, but there’s a lot more involved here. So I kind of unpack some of that to us. What are some of the moral, spiritual implications, things that people need to be thinking about, Christians in particular, when we’re talking about IVF? Where are the issues of concern?
SPEAKER 06 :
Jody, I can be very clear on this. As a convictional pro-lifer, the most significant concern with IVF is that a typical IVF cycle produces more embryos than could ever be implanted. This in vitro fertilization, the word in vitro actually means in glass, the process is that you are literally creating life in petri dishes. And the way that the technology works is, again, 98% of the time, you are intentionally creating 10, 12, 15 embryos and then selecting the ones that you think have the best chance of implanting. And so, again, this is the most significant issue with IVF as it is practiced, is that we have – and the thing is, Jodi, we have no idea, but it – Experts estimate about a million to a million and a half frozen embryos that are right now indefinitely being stored in freezers. And the big issue is that the vast majority of those embryos are either going to be frozen indefinitely, they will be discarded, or for some of them, they might be part of an experiment. And so I think theologically, This is our worldview segment. I think we want to think theologically as well, Jody, and I think we just need to recognize that when you introduce, the category is abstraction. When you abstract from the God-appointed means of reproduction, which is the marital act, the further you abstract from that, the more moral risk you introduce into the conversation. I think it’s important to note, all people, regardless if IVF is part of your history, every single person is made in God’s image. Every single person has value and dignity and worth. We celebrate life, Jody, but I don’t think the means, the end justifies the means, and there are serious moral issues. Again, the more Again, abstraction that you introduce makes this more and more risky in my view. And I think, you know, I would recommend right now, folks who are listening to this conversation, Andrew Walker, he was on the program with Tony a couple of days ago, kind of the leading evangelical thinker on this issue. Recommend watching that conversation. I think Andrew just makes some wonderful points that most Christians have not thought deeply about this. And the more Christians that think about this, who have those pro-life impulses and pro-life convictions, realize, wow, there are some aspects of this that are deeply problematic.
SPEAKER 04 :
Wow. Yeah, and when you think about millions of these embryos just sitting frozen somewhere, I mean, we as Christians biblically understand and believe that life begins at conception. So these are humans, right? There is frozen, many of which will be killed, some experimented on, like you said, trashed. I mean, who knows? We have to deal with this. This has to be on the table to discuss. All right, if I can, David, let me switch topics. There’s so much to talk about this week. I’m sure you saw the new Gallup poll that indicates that the LGBTQ identification in the United States is up a percent. They now say 9.3%. percent of adults in America identify LGBTQ. What’s your thoughts on this new finding?
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, Joseph, I often, or Jody, I know I often talk about how we live in a moral revolution. And increasingly, I think that that number is fueled particularly by the youngest adult demographic, Generation Z, those born between 1998 and I think 2005, 2006. It’s close to 20% of the youngest adult demographic identifies as LGBTQ, which is, again, making that overall national number a little bit higher than it’s ever been. And again, I’m not surprised. Every cultural institution, whether it’s the arts, think of the movies, higher education, is pushing this agenda. And so I think a large part of this, Jody, is that especially for those who identify as transgender, there is a social contagion that is a part of this that is fueling those numbers. But I think for Christians, Jody, it’s an opportunity to look at this. You know, as Christians, we want to be good cultural apologists. We want to be able to relate to our friends and neighbors. And I think our North Star in this conversation is Ephesians 4.15. that we speak the truth in love. And I think, again, we increasingly live in a post-Christian world. We need to realize that fewer of our friends and neighbors are going to understand our convictions, especially our sexual ethic. And again, we have to speak the truth. We need to be clear on where the Bible lands on this issue. We need to be clear where Jesus himself stands on this issue. But we also want to speak lovingly. We want to be people that are with filled with compassion and love and kindness. But we cannot retreat. And so we recognize, Jody, as far as a popular opinion, those of us who are theologically conservative are on the losing side of this. But at the end of the day, we are on God’s side. And I think that’s the side that we really do want to be on, of course.
SPEAKER 04 :
which is the winning side, I might add. Those numbers just seem a bit high to me still. Maybe I’m wrong, but great points, what you brought up. Let me switch you out again. Vice President J.D. Vance has been making all kinds of news this last couple of weeks. He’s fresh off his trip to Europe, where he literally scolded many of the European leaders for embracing censorship in their own countries. He was at CPAC this week. I want to play a real quick clip for you and get your response.
SPEAKER 07 :
cultural message is I think that it wants to turn everybody, whether male or female, into androgynous idiots who think the same, talk the same, and act the same. We actually think God made male and female for a purpose, and we want you guys to thrive as young men and as young women, and we’re going to help with our public policy to make it possible to do that.
SPEAKER 06 :
Pretty clear statement. Give me your comments. Well, Jody, how refreshing to have an American vice president who is speaking something that not that long ago would have just been seen as common sense. Not that long ago, most people hearing that statement would have been confused why a vice president of the United States of America felt that it was important to make the point that men and women are different. But increasingly, given where the culture and this moral revolution has gone, Those are issues that are contested. These are issues where people are confused. And so again, I just give kudos to J.D. Vance. This is an issue of the created order. This is something scripture is clear on. Male and female, created he them. And so I look at it, you know, we’re only a month into the new administration. How refreshing to hear people in a position of power to speak something that is abundantly and profoundly true and absolute. Absolutely.
SPEAKER 04 :
We’ve only got a little over a minute left, David. This is more than a vibe shift, if we can put it that way. Or let me at least put it that way. Christians want more than a vibe shift. We want to see real change in terms of towards a more biblical worldview, towards transcendent truth. How do we do that in the current culture in which we’re living?
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I think as Christians, we continue to speak the truth in love. Again, the goal for a Christian conservative is not that people vote Republican. It’s that people confess Jesus is Lord. And so I think part of our work and what we try to do here at FRC and the Center for Biblical Worldview is speak to the issues that Scripture is so clear on. Issues, again, that the vice president was just talking about. Issues like we started this segment when it comes to the life issue. There is a vibe shift. I think we all feel that in this country right now. And that’s exciting. It’s good that people are recognizing common sense truths. We don’t want men playing on the girls’ team. We don’t want boys in the girls’ locker room. These are good common sense principles, Jody. But at the end of the day, again, as Christians, we want people to meet Jesus. And so, again, I think that’s where our advocacy needs to head to. Again, that transcendent truth, that’s what’s so important. And that’s what we’re going to continue to advocate for here within the Center for Biblical Worldview.
SPEAKER 04 :
And Tony said it so well. I mean, we look at these things, they look like common sense, but Tony’s just made it so clear. He said, common sense is itself rooted in transcendent truth. And that is our mission. Thank you, David Claussen, Director of the Center for Biblical Worldview here at FRC. As always, great job. Thank you so much. Have a wonderful weekend.
SPEAKER 03 :
Thank you.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right, friends, that wraps up this edition. Hope you also have a fantastic weekend. We’ll see you next week here on Washington Watch.
SPEAKER 05 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council and is entirely listener supported. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information on anything you heard today or to find out how you can partner with us in our ongoing efforts to promote faith, family, and freedom, visit TonyPerkins.com.
