Menu
According to Dr. Robert Lewis, who is the pastor, author and founder of the original Men’s Fraternity, We have lost the ability to pass on to the next generation a vision of manhood that makes sense and is compelling to young men. On today’s edition of Family Talk, Dr. James Dobson and Pastor Lewis discuss the essentials of what it means to be a man, and why the inability of dads to connect with their sons can cause a huge loss of their masculine identity. Discover more as Dr. Lewis defines the different phases of training up boys, and why manhood is best forged under the wings of a dad.
To support this ministry financially, visit: https://www.oneplace.com/donate/707/29
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson, and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh, and I have a question for you, one that many parents and caregivers alike may wrestle with. And the question is, how do you teach a boy how to become a man?
This aspect of parenting, if left unchecked, can oftentimes lead to not properly guiding our sons into adulthood. On today's edition of Family Talk, we want to provide you with some insight and some answers to this age-old, child-rearing question. Now, the conversation we're about to hear was recorded several years ago, but we hope that you will find that this content is as relevant today as it was back then.
Dr. Dobson will talk about what it means to be an authentic, godly man with his guest, Dr. Robert Lewis. For more than 40 years, Dr. Lewis has been a pastor, writer, and speaker. Currently, he serves as Senior Advisor for Leadership Network.
He's also the founder of the Men's Fraternity, a ministry that provides a year-long Bible study to encourage men to live Christ-like lives. Dr. Lewis earned his Master's degree in Greek and another in Divinity from Western Seminary, and he also holds a Doctorate of Ministry degree from Talbot Theological Seminary. On today's program, Dr. Lewis will join Dr. Dobson for a conversation about his classic book, Raising a Modern Day Knight.
He'll explain why the Medieval Knight is the perfect example for educating boys today about the responsibilities of manhood. Dr. Lewis will also share with us about how his own father did not provide a good example to follow. He'll unpack why boys instinctively search for acceptance and praise from their fathers as well as other male role models.
Dr. Robert Lewis and his wife Sherrod have been married over 50 years. Together they have four grown children and three grandchildren. Okay, let's join Dr. James Dobson and his guest Dr. Robert Lewis right here, right now on Family Talk.
It has been your concern for a long time that most boys and even young adults do not know, maybe most is a too strong a word, many boys and young adults don't know what it means to be a man. That's a central theme of what you're writing about.
That's absolutely the essence of what the book's all about.
Why are we so confused about that?
I think it's because we have lost the ability to pass from one generation to the next a vision of manhood that makes sense and is compelling to young men. I think what a lot of dads do, the best dads, they'll spend time with their son, they'll have experiences with their son, they'll emotionally maybe even connect well with their son, but what they don't impart are some of what I think are the essentials of what it means to be a man in a way that is practical, specific, and compelling.
Well, you can't teach what you don't know. Many fathers aren't real sure what it means to be a man either.
Well, that's exactly.
I don't want to disparage a lot of people here, but the culture is confused about that.
Well, I don't think anyone has, in a sense, authorized the last few generations of dads to think it was their responsibility to do more than just provide for the home. I don't think they sense that they are to impart some kind of masculine vision that has specifics attached to it. They think their sons are just going to catch manhood.
And as I always tell dads, I say manhood is made. It has to be forged, and it's best forged under the wings of a dad.
Well, I wrote in my book that boys are not born knowing how to be a boy, much less a man. And there's a lot of confusion in how that information is transmitted. And a good part of the problem of homosexuality results in an inability to disengage from the mother's role at about 18 months to 5 years, and reattaching to a good man.
And that, you can get lost, there can be a sexual identity crisis in that transfer. If it never occurs, then you move on through childhood not really knowing who you are and what you're supposed to do, especially in this culture.
Well, it sounds a lot like the home I grew up in. I mean, the home I grew up in, my dad being a World War II veteran but emotionally absent from our family and not knowing how to personally connect with the three boys that were running around his feet in those early days, we suffered a huge loss in that, in a huge vacuum, and it confused us all. And different sons went different directions.
One of my brothers went the homosexual route.
He died of AIDS.
Yes, right, because of the disconnect that occurred there that never was filled.
Well, you know, that is precisely what I was talking about. So your brother is a living example of that lack of transfer that occurred because your dad wasn't there. You?
Yeah, he went one route. The other two boys went, we didn't go the same route, but we went different routes trying to fill that vacuum. I mean, I poured my life into athletics.
My brother poured his life into music. But we were all on a quest for something we didn't understand.
You talk in this book about your dad quite a bit and in a very poignant and powerful way. Your dad was an alcoholic. It's okay to say that.
You said it in the book.
Yeah, yeah, it's okay.
Yeah, and that...
It's a reality.
He was not only not a good father, but he had the capacity to be pretty violent.
Well, when I look at my dad now from adult eyes, I think a lot of... I don't think it was my dad didn't want to be a good father. I think most...
What I've learned is most men who are dads want to be a good father, but if they don't know how, they become clumsy, awkward, distant, and sometimes abusive. But I think my dad, he would have wanted to connect. I've never felt like he didn't want to connect.
He just didn't know how, and the frustration of that, plus a lot of other things in his life, led him to a place where alcohol basically consumed his life. The violence that happened in our home was really more of the result of alcohol than being a mean-spirited person.
In your childhood years, do you ever remember him telling you he loved you?
No. Never? Never.
Were you reaching for him?
Oh, yes. I think we would climb into his lap and do things. There were ways he showed affection, but the ability to verbalize affection was just something that was absent from our home.
And that hurt. I mean, I didn't realize it was hurting. I think what young boys do growing up in a home where they have that kind of emotional distance, they learn to compensate for it in different ways.
Sometimes not very healthy, but they learn to compensate. The thing is, in some ways, you cease to feel. You just have to put that aside and then point yourself in a different direction.
It's what I did in athletics.
Well, you were on a quest to find out what it means to be a man.
Right.
You've obviously found it. You're a very masculine man today and you have led a church. And yet, before you turned around, you had children of your own, boys of your, I think two boys, with the responsibility of teaching them what your father didn't teach you.
Right.
Where did you go to get the information?
That's a great question.
See, I haven't written the book yet.
Yeah. Well, I know that when I had our two sons, we had two daughters and two sons, but my two sons were the last born, the real turning point came a night where I was with two of my closest friends in their family and they had five other sons in the midst of their homes. And so here we were at a party with these seven little boys running around.
And one of the wives just simply asked this question. She turned to us and said, How are you going to raise these boys into being men? And the silence that followed was deafening.
Because we looked at each other and I think that's when it first hit me. I really didn't know. Maybe it was just one of those aha moments where I said, I'm going to find out.
And so that began the quest not only to be a good dad, but to discover a masculinity that I could see, understand and communicate.
Well, what you learned is now in this book, Raising a Modern Day Knight. And there is meaning to that title. It's not just an announcement that you're going to be talking about fathers and sons.
But you use as a model a medieval, classical approach to knighthood. Explain what you mean by that.
Well, in this quest to understand how to raise my sons into men, we took a summer in Europe on a mission trip as a family. I want to give my children that kind of experience. And when we were there, we actually lived in Poland for summer and got to explore these castles.
And that's where I got the first idea of this, because number one, knights, just by their very name, are associated with men who lived above the age, the dark ages. And I thought, that's what I want my sons to be like. That we're living in a difficult time, a crude and coarse culture.
I want noble men to be my sons. And so I started just looking at these knights around Poland and these castles, and you begin to see that knighthood was a process. It started with a young lad who trained under a knight and just the rudimentary elements of taking care of a knight as a page, and then he moved to being a kind of a partner with a knight as a squire up till he was about 18.
Then he went through a process of becoming a knight, which was usually in his early 20s, and then he gave his life to a cause that he spent the rest of his life pursuing. And I thought, you know, when I think of a boy, when I thought of my own childhood, I thought, you know, I go through stages that kind of follow those parallels. When you turn 13, as you have so eloquently written about becoming an adolescent in your tape series, I thought 13 is a critical stage, a page stage.
Leaving home at 18, going out on your own is a critical stage, kind of like a squire. Being affirmed by a community of men when you're setting foot into the work world at 21 is kind of like becoming a knight. And then a cause to live for is your work, and the woman that you pledge your life to.
That's kind of the cause of life. And I thought those would be wonderful as benchmarks to point our sons to, and at each moment, each one of those critical transitions, to build masculine truth in and to envision for them what an authentic man would be like.
You know, you mentioned adolescence. Many people don't know the difference between adolescence and puberty. They think they're one and the same.
They're really not. Puberty is that time of sexual awakening. All the hormones are beginning to increase and all of the influences of that early adolescent period.
But adolescence itself refers to, it's actually a cultural term. It refers to the period of time between childhood and adulthood. And in our culture, that period is the longest of probably any culture in history, because if you're going to go through high school and college and maybe graduate school, you're still dependent on your parents in some cases.
You're still not independent. You're still not a man. You're a student.
You haven't quite gotten there. So that adolescence can be protracted. But puberty is, you know, it occurs in just a period of months.
I'm told that there are African tribes which have no adolescence. A young man reaches 13, 14 years of age, and he is sent out into the wilderness at night to fight lions or snakes or whatever is out there. Even if they're mythical, he's out there alone for the night.
And then he comes back the next morning, if he survived, and he is a man. He goes from childhood to manhood in one night. He fights in the wars.
He is treated like a man. He has the respect of a man. He can marry like a man.
And we just have it a little different in Western cultures. But you are attempting to shepherd a young man through childhood and adolescence and young adulthood, if possible. And according to a plan, so it's not haphazard.
That's right. And it doesn't get extended where what you have is a 30-year-old boy. What you have is a son who, as he grows up, has road marks and markers and a community of men cheering for him to begin to make what I call responsible changes and to see a responsible and noble quest for his life that he can begin to orient his life to as he moves through these stages.
So like, for instance, at 13, for my sons, I went through your Preparing for Adolescent tape series. Did you really? Yeah, that was one of the things we did at six weeks before their 13th birthday.
We would meet in the morning. We would have a discussion. Sometimes it would extend to the evening.
But on his 13th birthday, we had a ceremony, and at that ceremony, he was presented with this vision of manhood, this definition of manhood that's summarized in the book. And I told him at his party that night, at that ceremony, that he was to memorize this definition, because from this point on, as a 13-year-old and beyond, I would call him to this definition to account, and that he could call me to account for that same definition, so that together, we could share a new manhood language of vision that we were both still on the quest for and would remain on the quest for for the rest of our lives.
And after that point, you dealt with him, not as a child.
That's right.
But as a young man.
That's exactly right. Ceremonies are significant because they become milestone markers, and they show that at each point, that more is expected. I did a wedding just the other night, and one of the things you do is you have this elaborate ceremony for a man and a woman, because they know they're going through a significant life change, and at the end of that ceremony, they'll walk out with symbols on their fingers and new responsibilities in their life.
At each one of these ceremonial occasions, that's exactly how the son leaves. He leaves with some symbol of that moment and new responsibilities, that he's being challenged, not just by me as his dad, but always incorporate a community of men to show that it's not dad's opinion, that this, with the men that he admires in his life, that this is a noble quest worth giving his life to, because not just dad, but other men are speaking the same language. So, the key marker is at 13, because of the changes that you said occur in his life, his body.
He starts seeing life differently. At 18, we do another major ceremony, mainly because each of our sons were leaving home to go to college. They were going to now have to make new decisions alone for themselves.
Their manhood would not be supported by the family anymore. It had to be supported by an internal vision. At 21 or 22, at that point, there was another ceremony, and that's where he was invited into the community of men, into this group of men that join with me in the book to raise our seven sons together.
It's amazing that you came up with this understanding, not having seen it modeled, and yet I know the answer to why, because you say in the book you had a coach who modeled it for you.
That's right.
I did too. Did you? Of course, my dad was a wonderful father and a great role model, but I also had a coach that had a major impact on me.
Well, I had, as any son who feels that disconnect, every son has father hunger, and I've met men as old as 70 who still have this incredible father hunger. They would just love for their dad to still say, I love you or I'm proud of you. And it just so happened that this coach, his name was Hoss Garrett, took note of me as I was coming up as a sophomore, junior, and senior in high school.
And it was the little...
What did you play?
I played middle linebacker. And there were just little...
Only sissies play that position, right?
That's right. We call it the headhunter position. And I loved it.
But I had a lot of anger to express in those days. And somehow that actually helped me in some ways being an athlete. But on the positive side, this coach just in the way took note of me and would affirm me in little ways.
I could feel my soul connecting to his. And I think he knew that. And he knew how to speak into my life at important moments.
And it was so impactful on my life that when my first born son was born, the first thing I want to do was name him after my coach.
Really? You know, I talk in my book about the single mother. And she worries often about the fact that there isn't a husband there, a father to model these principles for her son.
And I've strongly recommended just what you found, which is a substitute male figure, an uncle, a grandfather, a neighbor, a coach.
That's exactly right.
Somebody who can say, this is what a man does, and this is how a man thinks.
Yeah, a young boy growing up with a single mom needs to connect with a masculine hero. And when a mom comes to me, sometimes they've picked up modern-day night and they say, what can I do? And the first thing I tell them is, you cannot make your boy a man.
Only men make boys men. So your most strategic move is to stay a mom and connect this young son to a masculine hero. Somewhere, a coach, a Sunday school teacher, a boys club member, whatever.
But if you do that, it has an unbelievable effect on his life because it gives him a way to get that masculine food that his soul so desperately hungers for.
As a pastor, did you ever stand in the pulpit and say, there are single mothers here who have sons. To the other men who are here, I beg you to work in their lives. Include those boys with your sons.
Take them to football games or any other sporting event. Take them fishing. Take them hunting.
Be with them. Include them with your family. Because that's a God-given responsibility.
It's huge and it has a huge impact. In fact, not only did that, we had a number of men who formed different mentoring groups. I think of one who actually took, he was a well-known hunter and fisherman, and he actually got all the sports clubs of Arkansas to give a free day where dads could bring not only their sons, but a mail from a single parent home to spend a weekend hunting or fishing on these very nice hunting and fishing clubs.
But while they did it to allow this young boy the opportunity to drive a four-wheeler and know how to hook a fish and to feel that masculine spirit out in the wild to connect with him so that he would have somebody to look to.
Well that's what my dad did for me. I've said many times that my dad would take me hunting. We'd get up at 4.30 in the morning and we would drive out to the place I call the big woods because the trees looked so big to me.
We were hunting squirrel and quail and other things at that time. And he was different out there. He was mine.
He was with me. He related to me like a man out there. He was busy and into other things at other times.
My father was an evangelist. He was gone a lot. When he came home, he had time to be a father to me.
What a priceless gift. It's incredible. That's why I love we started a father-son camp where dads could come with their sons and also bring single mom-sons and mentor them.
But it's just a week of experiences like that because you get out in those wilds and it becomes a whole different... It does. And even just a week of focused attention between a dad and a son or a man and a young protégé is life-changing especially when they have masculine experiences together.
Are you still friends with your sons today?
I am. And three of them are in full-time ministry. All of them are vibrant young men who are healthy and making a difference in their community.
That's my definition of success.
That's right.
You accomplish that.
It's the ultimate success.
The ultimate. The title of the book is Raising a Modern Day Night by Dr. Robert Lewis. The subtitle is A Father's Role in Guiding His Son to Authentic Manhood.
This book has very practical ideas in it. And so many, in fact, that I would like to talk some more about it next time.
Thank you very much.
Well, it is no secret that boys certainly need God-led male role models to show them how to become men. And today here on Family Talk, Dr. James Dobson was joined by Dr. Robert Lewis for a conversation about raising men of honor. Now, this is part one of a two-part conversation based on principles in Dr. Lewis's classic book called Raising a Modern Day Night.
And if you'd like to learn more about Dr. Lewis, his ministry or that book, visit our website at drjamesdobson.org/familytalk. That's drjamesdobson.org/familytalk.
Of course, the essence of biblical masculinity is to care for and protect the family. And here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, based on a recent conversation with Riley Gaines, the all-American swimmer who has become the singular voice of reason in the culture for standing up for women in women's athletics against the radical transgender agenda, we have drafted a declaration to protect children that you can read and sign. It's written by Dr. James Dobson, Gary Bauer, our Senior Vice President of Public Policy here at the Dobson Policy Center, Dr. Owen Strand, Senior Director of the Dobson Culture Center and Joe Warsack, the President of the James Dobson Family Institute.
We as people united in our trust in Jesus Christ uphold the fundamental conviction that we are bound as parents and adults to love and protect our children. And you can show that love and protection for your kids by signing the Declaration to Protect Children. You can read it and sign it when you go to drjamesdobson.org/protect the children.
That's drjamesdobson.org/protect-the-children.
Now I mentioned Riley Gaines is one of the voices crying out in the wilderness for biblical values against the evils of this world. Well, as we approach Decision Day 2024, which is November 5th, Election Day, it's no secret that as Christians, one of the most important things we can do to witness our faith in Christ in the public square is to vote. That's why here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, we've done the heavy lifting for you.
We've researched the most important issues that Christians and Americans are facing today, especially in the swing states. And we've put together fact-based voter guides for each of those 10 key areas of our country. You can compare the candidates based on the God-given long-standing values that have made America a beacon of liberty.
To get your copy of our free voter guide, go to drjamesdobson.org/countdown to decision 2024. That's drjamesdobson.org/countdowndashtwodashdecision dash 2024. Now is the time for all of us to join together, to pray and to vote.
I'm Roger Marsh, and you've been listening to Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. Be sure to join us again next time for part two of Dr. Dobson's conversation with Dr. Robert Lewis talking about raising men of honor. That's right here on Family Talk.
This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Listen as Dr. James Dobson and Mary Crowley discuss the challenges women face, such as low self-esteem and the quest for self-fulfillment in a world full of distractions. Mary emphasizes the importance of confidence and a supportive community, sharing insights on finding personal success beyond societal norms. Through personal anecdotes and scripture-based wisdom, this episode aims to inspire women to discover God's plan for them and to thrive in every area of life.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh. And whether you're listening at home or on the go, you are in for something special today. We are bringing you a classic conversation featuring Mary Crowley, author of the book Women Who Win, Who We'll be right back. $400 million in business, powered by thousands of women working from their homes. The company became so successful that when they held a celebration, they filled an arena with 10,000 of their top saleswomen, and they featured Bob Hope and Billy Graham as special guests. But Mary's secret wasn't just business savvy. It was putting priorities in the right order. Mary started every company meeting by reading Scripture, often turning to the Proverbs for wisdom about leadership. And here's an interesting connection. Mary Kay Ash, who co-founded Mary Kay Cosmetics with a similar home party business model, was actually Mary Crowley's sister-in-law. Now, in her book, Women Who Win, Mary addresses a challenge many women still face today, and that is a lack of self-confidence. Her message is both simple and powerful. You are designed for fulfillment, and God has a plan for your life. Mary Crowley believed that by honoring God and serving others, women could find success both at home and in business. So let's listen now as Mary talks about those timeless principles with our own Dr. James Dobson on this special edition of Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
I would like to say this is one of the most generous women I have ever met. She supports Christian causes all across this country. And your generosity is legendary, Mary. So you have taken what God has given you and shared it with so many causes that you believe in. But where did all that start? How did you get into business?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I got in business 27 years ago. Actually, I'd been in direct selling business before that, but now my kids were grown and I saw a need. There was a need for American women to decorate their homes with excitement and with care. And from a coordinated line of accessories, I found that women were not sure what to do. And I'd worked for furniture companies before. And so we started the business to give women an opportunity to work from their homes, be there when the kids got home from school, and still use their creative genius, which God gave every woman. Every woman is a genius. Some just don't know it yet or haven't developed yet. And this is the idea of the business, and we had twin goals. One was to honor God, because I knew by then that if we didn't honor Him, we would not be successful. Now, that doesn't mean that people who do not belong to the Lord, and there are lots of successful people, quote, in the world, they can be successful. But if I've made a profession of faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and my Master, that I cannot be successful if I do not honor Him. Somehow along the line, he'll let me fall flat on my face. And I've done that a few times, too. I believe that's true. Absolutely. So it had to honor him. And then it had to bless and serve people. The whole world wants service. They can buy products. They can buy merchandise. They can buy lots of things. but we want genuine, caring, personal service. And that was our goal, to do that. And in so doing, to help the woman who was showing and selling our accessories to find fulfillment in herself and to have a fellowship of her sisters. You know, America needs places where people can go to belong, to find a support team. When our great-grandmothers came across the prairies, They had quilting bees and canning bees, and they had support teams for one another in their difficult times and in their joyous times. So we have built support teams all across America. And the fellowship is as important as the salesmanship. And so that's how we started. We started from our garage, very, very small. My son and my daughter and myself and a few friends, people that invested and believed in us. And it's grown beyond my wildest imagination, and it's pretty wild.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let's address some comments to the woman who is at home, where you were when you started. I don't know what your circumstances were, but let's suppose that she feels somewhat unfulfilled and somewhat frustrated. She wants to do something significant with her life. Maybe the kids now are in the teen years, and she knows they're going to be gone before too long, and she's wondering what now. What do you say to her? How does she begin to put it all together and find out who she is? Does that necessarily mean she's got to be successful in business like you are in order to find yourself?
SPEAKER 02 :
No. Again, I come back to the measure of success for each person. Success is a moving target. When you've got little kids at home, sometimes it's just getting through the day. You know, and then as they go into school and you begin to have other time, and then it may be reading good books and getting yourself, your mind activated again. Maybe it's starting an exercise program, whatever it is, that the measure of success that makes you feel fulfilled, it's different for everybody. And each person has to learn to define their own. Otherwise, they are always trying to
SPEAKER 03 :
Why do you think that moving target is so difficult for American women to hit? Why do you think so many American women are frustrated?
SPEAKER 02 :
Because they are trying to find their measure of fulfillment in what they're hearing, either on TV or maybe radio or reading in some magazine, instead of trying to find out what God's game plan is for them. I heard a wonderful interview with Walter Payton not long ago, and he defined something that was so great. The interviewer asked him, is your measure of success 100 yards gained in a game, as is the measure of success for a ball game for a running back? And he said, no, my measure of success is following the game plan consistently. designed for that game to the very best of my ability. And I thought that was a wonderful way to illustrate what everybody, God has a game plan for my life, for your life, for every woman out there with little kids or big kids or no kids. And if somebody tried to just copy mine, they might get very frustrated. I have a high energy level, and I can do a lot of things. Others might not. We're all made differently. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
Could it be that God's game plan for a particular woman would be to stay home and take care of three little kids under six years of age for this period of her life? Society is telling her that that's nobody's game plan. Could that be God's game plan for some people?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, he says that in his word, and then he also says that older women should help the younger women. And I think this is where, again, I was talking about a support team. A lot of young women with little children are feeling so alienated and so unsupported because maybe her parents or his parents do not live close. Society has not built a support team around them in our today's world. that's where they need to find a support team. They have to have fellowship with other women, and maybe it's a Bible class, maybe it's a home interior show, maybe it's coming in part-time, or maybe it's simply finding other group of women who have uplifting, motivating things to do. put in their hours otherwise sometimes we do recruit mothers with young kids because she's sitting there watching the daytime dramas and living in a fantasy world and that is no good for her and so if we can enlighten her and lift her up and give her something to do part-time that will fulfill her desires and create you know we try to develop her creative talents women want to be accepted understood and developed They don't want to stay static. They want to be developed. So whatever. If you're sitting out there and you're thinking, well, I'm not being developed, then you find something that develops your mind, your spirit, your being. And don't sit there and get caught in that daytime drama trap of fantasy world. That's the worst thing.
SPEAKER 03 :
You're talking about soap opera.
SPEAKER 02 :
I am, I am. Well, that's terrible.
SPEAKER 03 :
It really is.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, but that's what happens to a lot of women who are home with little kids, Dr. Dobson. That's what happens to them. And so then just being at home with the children does not minister to their spirit or does not even help them to be good mothers unless they must have a plan to be a successful mother and a successful wife and woman.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, what do you say to the person who is very frustrated in their present job? Do you have any advice to a person who just feels they're in a dead-end trap? Change it. Absolutely. But it costs money. I'm making more money than I could make someplace else. Yeah, but it's not making you happy, so what good is it? But I've got to feed my family.
SPEAKER 02 :
Find another way to feed them. No, it isn't really worth it if people are frustrated in their jobs unless there is a real way that they can change the frustration in that job. If it's their attitude, then they better change the attitude. But if it's the job itself and there is no hope of fulfillment, then change the job. Life's too short and too wonderful to waste it on frustration. Now, we'll have frustrations in all jobs. People need to realize that. There are days of frustration in any job, and you can't expect a frustration-free job. But at the end of the day, there must be something that you feel that you've accomplished in the lives of other people. or in going forward in your measure of success or something that you have done that is an accomplishment at the end of every day. Oh, there'll be days you think, well, what did I accomplish today? I've just not even gotten through the mail. I didn't get through the dishes. I didn't get through there too many. You know, we live in the day of distractomania. But you can find something, some life that you touched, something that you did that made the doing worthwhile.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think you've put your finger on really the critical issue having to do with the support team. I've tried to write and talk about that because I find many women know they need that but don't know how to go and get it. I was counseling with a young mother just the other day in my office, and she said, I don't have anybody. I don't have any close friends. The one I had turned her back on me. And this is a very bright woman who's a schoolteacher and is very capable, very verbal, very able to get out and meet the world. Oh, I need to recruit her. And yet I find many women like that don't know how to take the first step. There is a lack of confidence perhaps to go outside that front door and maybe somebody will hurt me or reject me and it's just easier or seems easier to pull in and let the four walls collapse. I guess you're really addressing that problem.
SPEAKER 02 :
We do. We address that problem a great deal. And you hit it when you said lack of confidence. One time I took a poll all across America from thousands of women, asked them what were their three greatest problems personality-wise, society-wise, business-wise, or family-wise. And north, south, east, and west, there was no names on the papers. It was lack of self-confidence, low esteem. I was just floored. Here's the greatest nation in the earth, the highest educational level for all women, the greatest opportunities. So I set about my goal is to help every woman I meet or that hear the sound of my voice to feel better about herself, to realize you are designed for life. God has a plan for your life, but I fully believe that they cannot find it till they find that absolute, till they realize that God is their creator, he is their maker, and then they begin to understand what is the character of God. He loves, he cares, he's just, he's fair, he has great things for us. And once you find that, you see, people often say to me, well, haven't you been discriminated against as a woman? Well, maybe I just didn't have sense enough to know it. But you see, if somebody tries to put me down, it diminishes them, not me. My self-worth is tied up in the character of God himself. And once any woman finds that out, she's redeemed. She's free to be herself and then free to have the confidence to say to somebody, look, I need some help. I want to get to know some people. And how do you turn people with low self-esteem into good salespeople? Well, first of all, they have to learn what selling really is. They have an idea that selling is going out and talking and convincing people. No, it is not. True selling is serving a need in that person. And women are very good at understanding that once you find what this person needs and help them fill the need. Women are in the habit of filling needs of children, of husbands, of You know, they're nurturers by very nature. And once they realize that it's a natural for them to be able to find the need and to fill it and to help the person in a serving way, they realize that it isn't something big out there that they have to learn, but it's something that they already have, a natural opportunity. ability to do. We just need to develop that ability and help them see what it really is. It's a matter of learning what selling really is. Most people think of it as something that you talk and that you convince. No, it's finding out person to person what her needs and desires and likes are, what she needs in her life, what she needs in her home, and then I can help you find that. I can help you Express your love for your family on the wall or in the figurines or the way that you even arrange a bouquet of flowers. And women are natural nurturers and natural helpers in this area. So once she finds out that she already has the natural ability, we just help her develop it.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, my book, What Wives Wish Their Husbands Knew About Women, is based on this same thing we're talking about here, where I ask over 10,000 women to rank order the sources of depression in their lives. And it blew me away, too, that the number one source of depression in young, middle-class, seemingly happily married Christian women was low self-esteem, 50%. of the original test group that I based this little study on put that number one, and 80% put it in the top five. So this pervasive lack of confidence, lack of self-worth, is extremely widespread in our culture. And I think, again, it comes back to television to some degree, where every woman feels like she's got to be beautiful and young and successful and the object of somebody's great romantic love and attention in order to feel acceptable and to feel the confidence necessary to cope with life. And unfortunately, that support system just often isn't there.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, and not everybody is young and slim and gorgeous.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, unfortunately. What do you do, Mary, when you're looking eye to eye with a very powerful male corporate executive who has the authority to move great numbers of people and so on? You being a woman, do you look eye to eye with him?
SPEAKER 02 :
Oh, absolutely. Oh, I thoroughly enjoy him. I'm on lots of boards where I'm the only woman. But I don't come in and try to be a pushy female. Let me be sure that I do say that. I am there to make a contribution, not to compete. And with that complete positive attitude, I never have any difficulty there. Because God made us to have special roles and special talents and special abilities. And I can greet and meet and deal with people Corporate executives are presidents. Well, that's now.
SPEAKER 03 :
You've got 39,000 people on your staff. What about when you had one? What about when you were beginning? Did you have that kind of confidence, or did it grow through the years?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, part of it has grown through the years, but I always had a lot of confidence. Well, the good Lord born me on April Fool's Day. That was wonderful, because most people worry about making a fool of themselves, and they won't do things that are going to make a fool. I didn't have to worry about that. You'd already gotten the title. I'd already gotten the title, yeah. So... But part of it comes from the fact that, well, my grandparents taught me to... place the bible as one of you know our priorities not long ago i gave a speech to young people and i took a tv guide and a bible with me and i held them up i said all of you have these two books in your home which one do you refer to the most next week dr alan redpath from england recently spoke and he said in england we used to base our morality on the bible now we base it on tv And I thought, you know, that's exactly what's happening in America, really. And so in looking at the Bible, God is who he says he is in his book. I am who he says I am in his book. And since he's who he is and I'm who he says I am, I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.
SPEAKER 03 :
Who does he say you are, Mary?
SPEAKER 02 :
He says that I am a child of his. If I believe in Jesus Christ, I'm joint heirs with him. Wow! Wow! What kind of a promise that is. And then, oh, you know, many, many places he says, you talk about giving. Over in Thessalonians where he says, if you will give and share that all grace will be given in all situations and all your needs will be met. Now, that is a pretty powerful promise. And I've been claiming those for years. Tithing to me is the secret of it. You see, what I can make is not for me to be hoarding. It's a channel. It's a channel. It's kind of like forgiveness. Forgiveness is not given to us in a cup. It's given to us in a pipeline. So what I receive is to be given. You can't out-give God. He just multiplies it. I am just amazed at Him.
SPEAKER 03 :
What do you say to the people who just feel like they can't tithe? Mary, they just can't pay their bills now, and they are $75 short every week, and just isn't enough to go around, and the kids need shoes, and there's a hole in the roof, and we're trying to put our oldest boy into Christian schools. How in the world am I going to give any money to the Lord's kingdom?
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, I go back to when I started tithing, and it was about 40 years ago. And I was in just that same situation. I had two kids. I was a single parent. I was raising two kids. The war was on. I was working for an insurance company. My income had not risen like other people's had. It was pledge time at the First Baptist Church in Dallas, and I always pledged and gave, but I didn't think I could tithe. So, particularly night, though, the kids were asleep, and I was wrestling with that, and I was telling the Lord all the reasons I could not tithe. Hmm. And I thought of that verse in Proverbs, you know, but is the Lord convinced? He speaks to us through our creative genius mind that he gives us. Well, Mary, you're not doing such a hot job of it yourself. Why don't you give me a chance? I said, okay, Lord, I check tithe. It's your problem. It's your management of my life. I'm going to bed. So then I had to explain to our housekeeper and the kids, you know, we had to take it out first because if you don't take it out first, it won't be there. And we ate oatmeal quite a bit there in the beginning, and some of them would grumble and everything. Something happens. I can't explain it. I don't understand God's mathematics. But within two months' time, I was able to get out of debt. Behind the eight ball wasn't debt per se, but just get caught up. From that day till this, we didn't suddenly have a lot of money. But something did happen. And I can guarantee that if you give God's management of your money, he has management of your life. Things change. It really is true. I cannot explain it. It really is true. I challenge people. I've challenged. I teach classes. I told you of people, 150 people single by death or divorced. A lot of them have aging parents and a lot of problems. I challenge them every year. I say, okay, you tithe for six months. And at the end of six months, if you're not better off than you are now, I'll pick up the tab for the difference.
SPEAKER 03 :
You just said that to three million people.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's right. And I have never yet anybody take me up on it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Jesus spoke more about money than any other subject. So it must be extremely important to our spiritual welfare as well as to our financial welfare.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, it's exciting.
SPEAKER 03 :
Mary, we have a great deal of love for you, as I've said, for the kind of person you are, what you represent, not what you give, but who you are. You love the Lord, and it shows in everything that you do. And it's been a pleasure meeting your staff. Some of your people came with you today, and they're sitting in the gallery over there watching us broadcast today. And I just hope that you'll come back, continue doing the great work that you're doing. And I just trust the Lord will be very close to you in this coming year.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you. It's been a joy to be here. And I guess I would like to say to every person out there, trust Him, try Him, prove Him. He will never let you down.
SPEAKER 03 :
You really mean that?
SPEAKER 02 :
I really mean that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Have you found that true of your entire lifetime?
SPEAKER 02 :
Absolutely. See, I've learned that Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. And I can absolutely say, without any doubt at all, if you really trust Him... He has a better plan for your life than you can have for yourself. And I am amazed at what he's done with one little orphan gal.
SPEAKER 03 :
Bless you, Mary. Our prayers and our thoughts will be with you. Thank you.
SPEAKER 01 :
Christianity is not a way of doing certain things. It's a certain way of doing all things. What a great thought to wrap up today's classic program featuring the late Mary Crowley here on Family Talk. Now, you've been listening to Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk and a timeless conversation between Dr. Dobson and his guest, Mary Crowley, about finding purpose, building confidence, and trusting God's plan for your life. Mary's remarkable journey from a single mother to building a multi-million dollar business, all while putting God first, continues to inspire women even today. By the way, if you missed any part of this classic program, or if you'd like to share it with someone who really needs a word of encouragement today, visit drjamesdobson.org, or you can find the program easily on the Family Talk app. Here at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, we are committed to helping you and your family grow closer to God and each other. But these daily broadcasts and resources are only made possible through the generous support of friends like you who share our vision for strong, faith-filled families. Your tax-deductible donation today will help us continue broadcasting messages of hope and practical wisdom to millions of listeners in America and all over the world. To make a secure donation online, go to drjamesdobson.org. Or if you prefer, you can send your donation through the mail. Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, P.O. Box 39000, Colorado Springs, Colorado, the zip code 80949. And for more daily inspiration and biblical guidance, I encourage you to explore our reading plans in the Bible app by YouVersion. You can choose from 48 different plans, 24 on marriage and 24 on parenting. Each one contains three lessons to encourage growth in your relationships. These brief devotionals are perfect for busy parents or couples who want to grow together in their faith. Just open the Bible app on your phone or mobile device, search for Dr. James Dobson, and start your first reading plan today. Well, I'm Roger Marsh and from all of us here at Family Talk, we are so grateful that you've joined us for today's classic program. Be sure to join us again next time for another edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Join us as we delve into Job 42, the final chapter that wraps up our 30-day venture through the compelling story of Job. Witness the restoration of Job's fortune and the renewal of his life after unspeakable trials. Job's sparking repentance and acknowledgment of God's sovereignty serve as eternal lessons for us to remain steadfast in our own life challenges. As we explore reflections from over three decades of journaling, gain valuable insights into maintaining faith and trust in the divine, even when life's trials feel insurmountable.
SPEAKER 01 :
Welcome to Add Bible, an audio daily devotion from the Ezra Project. Alan J. Huth shares a Bible passage with comments from over 35 years of his personal Bible reading journals and applies the Word of God to our daily lives.
SPEAKER 02 :
Today we reach Job chapter 42, the last chapter of the book of Job, and the last of our 30-day adventure through this book. We'll see Job respond to God one more time, we'll see God speak, and we'll see God restore everything to Job. Let's listen in to the last chapter of the book of Job, chapter 42. Job 42
SPEAKER 04 :
Then Job answered the Lord and said, I know that you can do all things and that no purpose of yours can be thwarted. Who is this that hides counsel without knowledge? Therefore I have uttered what I did not understand, things too wonderful for me which I did not know. Hear and I will speak. I will question you and you make it known to me. I had heard of you by the hearing of the ear, but now my eye sees you. Therefore I despise myself and repent in dust and ashes.
SPEAKER 05 :
After the Lord had spoken these words to Job, the Lord said to Eliphaz the Temanite,
SPEAKER 03 :
My anger burns against you and against your two friends, for you have not spoken of me what is right as my servant Job has. Now therefore take seven bulls and seven rams and go to my servant Job and offer up a burnt offering for yourselves. And my servant Job shall pray for you, for I will accept his prayer not to deal with you according to your folly." for you have not spoken of me what is right as my servant Job has.
SPEAKER 05 :
So Eliphaz the Temanite and Bildad the Shuhite and Zophar the Naamathite went and did what the Lord had told them. And the Lord accepted Job's prayer. And the Lord restored the fortunes of Job when he had prayed for his friends. And the Lord gave Job twice as much as he had before. Then came to him all his brothers and sisters and all who had known him before and ate bread with him in his house. And they showed him sympathy and comforted him for all the evil that the Lord had brought upon him. And each of them gave him a piece of money and a ring of gold. And the Lord blessed the latter days of Job more than his beginning. And he had fourteen thousand sheep, six thousand camels, one thousand yoke of oxen, and one thousand female donkeys. He had also seven sons and three daughters. And he called the name of the first daughter, Jemima, and the name of the second, Keziah, and the name of the third, Karenhapik. And in all the land there were no women so beautiful as Job's daughters. And their father gave them an inheritance among their brothers. And after this Job lived 140 years and saw his sons and his sons' sons four generations. And Job died an old man and full of days.
SPEAKER 02 :
We'll take a look for the last time at those journals I've been using through the book of Job. We'll begin with 1984 as I finished the book of Job with chapters 41 and 42. And I wrote, Job repents. God restores him. 41.11 says, Who has given to me that I should repay him? Whatever is under the whole heaven is mine. And 42.2 says, I know that thou can do all things. Thirteen years later, in 1997, I finished the book of Job. With chapters 35 through 42 on the last day, I wrote, God speaks to Job and his friends. Prepare yourself like a man. I will question you and you shall answer me. God puts Job in perspective. He never ever addresses Job's issues but declares his sovereignty. Everything under heaven is mine. When Job has a chance to answer, he laid his hand over his mouth. I will not answer. There is no answer or question to God. He simply repented for ever questioning God. Lord, forgive me for whining or ever questioning you. Give me strength to live in your sovereignty. And 18 years later, in 2015, I finished the book of Job by reading chapters 40 through 42 on the same day. And I wrote, God calls those who question him fault finders. Job desired, waited for the opportunity to present his case before God. He now has the chance to do so and he says nothing. We are so small before God, our articulation is babbling. Doubtful if any of us are going to question God or present our futile case before him. God never answers Job. He never explains what happened to Job. He reminds Job of how big he is. Job responds, God restores the fortunes of Job. after he prayed for his friends. Job lives 140 years, so his suffering may have been a very short trial in his life. How am I handling my trials? In this last chapter of the book of Job, Job does speak to God. Let's go back and see what he had to say. In verse 2, I know that you can do all things, and that no purpose of yours can be thwarted. In verse 3, he says, Therefore I despise myself and repent in dust and ashes. Job never argues his case before God, does he? Nor will we. Job understands he has no case before God, nor do we. So Job never does understand what happened back in chapter 1, in the book that carries his own name. God does not need to explain himself. After Job successfully faces his trial, this test from God Almighty, Then the Lord restores everything back to Job. Verse 10, And the Lord restored the fortunes of Job when he had prayed for his friends, and the Lord gave Job twice as much as he had before. Verse 12, And the Lord blessed the latter days of Job more than his beginning. Verse 16, And after this Job lived 140 years. And verse 17, And Job died an old man and full of days. Notice too, the restoration of Job only came after he was restored to his friends. He had to pray for them, and God said he would hear that prayer from Job. How do you feel after completing the book of Job? Do you feel a little let down that God never tells Job what really happened? Do you feel challenged by your own personal trials and how Job was handled his and he remained faithful? And are you questioning whether you can remain faithful during the trial that God has you in? Or do you feel like you're on the way out of a trial and that you will be restored? Has Job helped build your faith and trust in God? Do you feel sorry for your questioning of God through your life? And do you feel like repenting? Like Job did. Again, look at verse 6. Therefore I despise myself and repent in dust and ashes. Job repented. Do you need to? When we started Job, we said the theme of Job is can God be trusted? It responds to our heart's desire to question God, to wonder about our faith in a sovereign God when things don't appear to be going right. We said Job questioned God, but while demonstrating unshakable faith... Has our journey through Job given you unshakable faith? Let's close out our journey through the book of Job in prayer. Father, we thank you for this book, a book of despair, a book of trial, a book of trouble, a recap of a life much like our own. Job suffered. He lost it all, but his faith never wavered. As you put us through the tests of life, may we be like Job. May our faith never waver. Thank you for strengthening us through this book. Thank you for reminding us the trials will come in our lives. Thank you for reminding us of who you are. You're bigger than any trial we will ever face. And thank you for the promise of restoration. You restored Job. May you restore us as well. Thank you for the lessons of life in the book of Job. Holy Spirit, apply them to each of our journeys. as we continue our sojourn on the earth. Job had many more years to live after this trial. We may too. So thank you for the promise of restoring us. We give you all the praise and the glory. Amen. Thanks for listening to AdBible today. Our radio programming is set for 2025. We will cover 44 of the 66 books of the Bible using the Ezra Project day by day through the Bible 11 book series. We start at January 1 with the writings of the Old Testament historical books beginning with Job. We will cover seven more historical books until spring when we jump into the New Testament writings of Mark, Peter, James, Jude, and Hebrews. By summer, we will go back to the Old Testament writings of all 13 of the minor prophets. We'll finish 2025 with the writings of Paul. Maybe you don't want to follow the Ad Bible Radio programming in your daily quiet time. Okay, I offer you an alternative plan. Read the Bible chronologically starting any day you want. The Bible is not organized the way things occurred. You can order an Ezra Project Chronological Bible Reading Journal and experience an amazing journey through the Bible in the order things actually occurred. The first time I read the Bible chronologically, it was an aha experience. While reading Kings and Chronicles, I read the prophets who were alive at the time. In the New Testament, you read about a miracle or a parable by all four gospel writers on the same day. It was a very educational and inspiring way to read the Bible. One user said this about our chronological Bible reading journal. Some years ago, I used a couple of spiral notebooks for my journaling. I've attached pictures of the book, the first edition of the Ezra Project Bible Reading Chronological Journal. That was the picture he sent. I live in Phoenix now, and I cannot find any place that has this type of journal. I've used many types of journals recently, but this seems to work the best for my needs. Please let me know if these are still available. Yes, they are. In fact, it is our number one best-selling product of all time. Visit azureproject.net and order a chronological Bible reading journal today and start your chronological journey through the Bible. I know you're going to enjoy it and want to share it with others. To support AddBible, visit EzraProject.net, the donate button. For a one-time gift of $39 or more, we will send you a free copy of one of our day-by-day through the Bible books. And for a gift of $100 a month, we will send you the entire 11-volume series covering all 66 books of the Bible, chapter by chapter. You will get a book a month for the first 11 months of your $100 a month contribution. So support the Ezra Project today by going online and hitting the donate button at ezraproject.net.
In this inspiring episode, Dr. Dobson and Dr. Hawkins discuss The Nehemiah Code, emphasizing its message that it’s never too late for a new beginning. Explore how Nehemiah's biblical account can inform our approach to leadership, teamwork, and personal growth today. Listen as they highlight the importance of building strong foundations and fostering community to overcome life's obstacles.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, hello everyone. I'm James Dobson and you're listening to Family Talk, a listener-supported ministry. In fact, thank you so much for being part of that support for James Dobson Family Institute.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome back to Family Talk. I'm Roger Marsh, and on today's program, we're going to hear part two of a fascinating conversation featuring Dr. Dobson and his guest, Dr. O.S. Hawkins, former pastor of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, and president emeritus of Guidestone Financial Resources. On our last broadcast, Dr. Hawkins shared about his ministry helping retired pastors through Mission Dignity, and he introduced his popular series of code books that help believers dive deeper into Scripture. Today, he'll take us into the powerful story of Nehemiah, showing us how this ancient tale of rebuilding Jerusalem's walls offers practical wisdom for anyone seeking a fresh start in life. Now, these insights come from Dr. Hawkins' book, The Nehemiah Code. It's never too late for a new beginning. Through the story of Nehemiah, we'll discover timeless principles for starting fresh. whether we're rebuilding relationships, restoring faith, or seeking a new direction in life. Dr. Hawkins will remind us that with God's help, genuine transformation is always possible. And now let's rejoin Dr. James Dobson for part two of this inspiring conversation here on Family Talk.
SPEAKER 02 :
Dr. Hawkins, thank you so much for being with us again today. I love the program we did together last time. And we've got a lot more to talk about related to your book, The Nehemiah Code. It's never too late for a new beginning. And what I... love about this book is that I really love the story of Nehemiah. But I want to take that story back before you start with the book to how we pick up Nehemiah in Babylon. He was a cupbearer for the king, wasn't he?
SPEAKER 03 :
To King Artaxerxes, yes. And the beautiful thing about Nehemiah, what I like to remind people is he wasn't a preacher. He wasn't a prophet. He wasn't a theologian. He was not a theologian. He was a civil servant. He had a civil service job as cupbearer to Artaxerxes with all the fringe benefits, retirement benefits, everything, and he left it all to be the rebuilder of the broken walls. You know, after the death of King Solomon, as you know, the kingdom of Israel divided into a northern kingdom and a southern kingdom. In the northern kingdom, They were ruled by all wicked kings. There wasn't one good king among them. And in 722, the Assyrians took them away into captivity, and they never returned. The southern kingdom— Did Nebuchadnezzar's army do that? No, that was the Assyrians in 722. In 586, then, to the southern kingdom, Nebuchadnezzar came and besieged Jerusalem. in a horrible siege, and they destroyed the city, broke the walls down, burned the gates, and they took the brightest Jewish minds they could find back to Babylon.
SPEAKER 02 :
Daniel was one of them.
SPEAKER 03 :
Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego, and others. And they took them back to re-educate them. They tried to change their language. They tried to change their literature. All those things you can read about in the book of Daniel. And so after a period, the Persians broke the Babylonian supremacy. A remnant had returned to Jerusalem to rebuild the walls, and they got so discouraged that they quit. And Nehemiah heard a report that Jerusalem was a reproach, and the walls were still broken, the gates burned. And he went to the king and begged permission to go back to Jerusalem, and he was granted. And Nehemiah went back to Jerusalem. He made a midnight ride on a horse around the walls, and he wept over the ruins. He did. And he began fasting. He fasted and prayed before the God of heaven, the Bible says. And then he moved and mobilized that remnant that was there that for years had left that city dormant. And in 52 days, they rebuilt the city. And there's some incredible evidence. applications there to how any of us, whoever we are, whatever our circumstance, can rebuild our own broken lives. Because as the subtitle of the book says, and the message of Nehemiah is this, it's never too late for a new beginning.
SPEAKER 02 :
And that's exactly what he did and began building the wall. And it wasn't that he didn't have opposition. Sanballat, as I recall, was out on the edge of town, and he was making fun of him.
SPEAKER 03 :
He said if a fox runs up on it, it'll fall down. Sanballat and Tobias and others, he faced incredible opposition. But he kept focused. He kept going forward. The book is divided into several sections of what you need to do to be a rebuilder. First of all, you've got to get started right. And that's what Nehemiah did. Rebuilders get started right. They make an honest evaluation of the situation. They identify with the need. They take personal responsibility. And then they move out of their comfort zones. You know, we live today in comfort zones. Some of us don't have anything to do with anybody unless they're in our socioeconomic level. or political level, or whatever, educational level. So he got started right. Then the second thing he did, he built a team spirit. And that is so vital in rebuilding. He was a great organizer, wasn't he? He was a credible organizer. And if I had a pencil in my hand right now, a wooden pencil, I could easily break it. But if I put two or three together, it's exponentially more difficult to break. We call that synergy. That's what he did. You know, the Bible says if one can chase 1,000, two can chase 10,000. He understood and recognized that we all need each other in the rebuilding process. So he built this team spirit of those around him. He started with his goal in mind, seized his opportunities, and motivated his people to get off a dead center. One of the most important things he did, he was an example himself. You know, the greatest leadership principle I know in or outside the Bible, and there are millions of leadership books, I suppose. But Gideon, in Judges 7-7, he got his army down to 300 people, as you remember, and was going out to fight thousands of the Midianite host with that little army. And the last thing he said to them, he turned to them in Judges 7-7 and said, do as I do. It's the greatest principle of leadership, I know, because eventually, those of us in leadership, the people on our team are going to do what we do. And so this was one of the real secrets of Nehemiah. He was there with them. He was putting those stones in with them. He was building. He was up and down the lines, showing them appreciation. One of the greatest motivating factors in the rebuilding process is to give people a pat on the back. To say they're appreciated. Let them know that they're appreciated. This is what Jesus did. He went around.
SPEAKER 02 :
And do as I do.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, and do as I do. This is what Jesus did. He went around affirming people. Affirmation is vitally important.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, a related passage in Scripture. related to Nehemiah is found in the book of Ezra. And Ezra was a priest. And they got in there. This is a wonderful passage. I think it's in the 10th chapter of Ezra. And Nehemiah had to be close at hand. And they got into the ruins of of Jerusalem and came across the scrolls, and they began reading them, and their eyes were opened to their sin, and they were marrying foreign wives and so on. And there was a platform there, and Ezra got up on that platform. and began reading the scrolls.
SPEAKER 03 :
Just read the Word of God.
SPEAKER 02 :
And their eyes popped open, and they began weeping. If there's a moment in Scripture, or one of them, that I would most like to have been there, is to be there when this repentance, this revival broke out through the people. And they say, we sinned against the God of heaven. And they fell on their faces, and Nehemiah was weeping. And that was the beginning of the energy that helped to rebuild the wall, wasn't it?
SPEAKER 03 :
And as the Bible says, it's not my word, God said, like a hammer that breaks a rock to pieces. And when the word of God goes forth, not just in Ezra and Nehemiah's day, but in our day, When we get the word of God into our heart, it makes a huge difference.
SPEAKER 02 :
Don't you wish that spirit would spring across this country and that people would say, oh, I didn't know that was in the Bible. I didn't know what I was doing. Was that wrong? We have sinned against God. Forgive us, Lord. We repent of our sin.
SPEAKER 03 :
Exactly. And that's really the motivating factor that I have behind all these code books, because every one of them go to the Scripture, because it's the Bible. It's the Scripture that brings conviction. You know, there's a lost word in our Christian vocabulary, conviction. When Peter stood up and read from Joel and illustrated it with some Psalms on the day of Pentecost and preached that great Pentecostal proclamation, do you remember what it says? It says their hearts were cut. They fell under deep conviction, and that only comes from the Word of God. You know, another thing about Nehemiah was how he dealt with, I call it, rebuilders never cut what they can untie.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, I read that, and that didn't ring true to me. I didn't know what you meant by that, but now I do. Explain it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you were a little boy in Fort Worth, and so was I. And in my block over on the east side of Fort Worth, there was an old vacant lot on that block. And that was our ball fit. It was like Yankee Stadium to me and my buddies on Crenshaw Street. And we'd play ball up there. And there was one kid that would come to that vacant lot. And he would always have – he had a pair of black canvas high-top tennis shoes. This was back in the 50s when I was a boy. And those shoes would only be laced up halfway up to the top. And there'd be several eyelets at the top unlaced because he was so impatient that when he would get a knot in his shoelaces, instead of taking the time to untie them, he'd take his pocket knife out and just cut them off. And that's the way a lot of people do in relationships. They don't want to take the time and the effort and the energy to untie those knots that get into a relationship. So they just come along. And for some people, it's easier just to cut them off. And that's why they go from one relationship to another, to another, to another. But when you're rebuilding relationships, You never cut what you can untie. Conflict resolution is a vital important of Nehemiah's story because conflict will tear your team apart. It doesn't matter whether it's at church or at home or in business or wherever. And so Nehemiah, there were four things he did to resolve conflicts. And timing was everything. He said there's a time to back off. There's a time to stand up. There's a time to give in. And there's a time to reach out. You know, some of us don't know when those times are. Some of us, all we do is stand up when we have a conflict and just get in somebody else's face and just move in like a bull and a child. Some of us, just all we do is back off, and we never even deal with it. There's a time to back off and seek God's counsel. That's what I mean about it. But there's also a time to stand up for what's right, and there's a time to give in. You know, when we were raising our daughters with all those books from Dobson – I discovered early on that I would a lot rather lose a few little insignificant battles that didn't amount to a hill of beans and win the bigger war. So I gave in on some non-essentials that I really didn't want to, but they didn't amount to anything. So there's a time to give in, but there's also a time then to reach out. And if you want to know the beautiful illustration of this, we were all in conflict with God. As you mentioned ago, we've all sinned and come short of the glory of God. We're all in conflict with God. So this is the story of the gospel. Christ came to mend the broken relationship. Christ came to reconcile us to God. Christ came to reconcile that conflict resolution. And so what did he do and how did he do it? Those four things. He backed off. See him in Gethsemane's garden the night before the crucifixion, neat those old olive trees, backed off, prayed, took in so he could give out at Calvary. If it's possible, Lord, let this pass from me. Nevertheless, not my will, but yours. Then secondly, we see him after backing off, standing up. He stood up before Caiaphas. He stood up before Annas. He stood up before Pontius Pilate. And then we see him giving in. Nobody pushed him or shoved him up the Via Dolorosa. He went as a lamb for the slaughter, willingly laid down. And finally on the cross, with arms outstretched, we see him reaching out as though he were saying, whosoever will may come. And through him, we can be reconciled to God.
SPEAKER 02 :
And the Lord will forgive and embrace and love. But it requires something on your part. We confess our sins.
SPEAKER 03 :
He's faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness.
SPEAKER 02 :
Hey, tell me that phrase again that I said I didn't understand in the beginning. Never cut what you can untie. All right. And related to the strings? Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
Related to conflict resolution. Take the time to untie those broken relationships.
SPEAKER 02 :
What's the next point from your book, The Nehemiah Code?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, we talk about how Nehemiah let go without letting up. The secret to what he did was his ability to delegate and to use other people. He let go without letting up. He was the master of this. He set clear objectives. Some of us are trying to rebuild businesses or churches. Set some clear objectives with specific tasks if you want people to be on your team. Let them know what to do. Pick the right person for the right job. So often we put the right person in the wrong job or the wrong person in the right job. Somewhere there's a job that each of us can do.
SPEAKER 02 :
Can you imagine Nehemiah setting out to rebuild a wall?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 02 :
What is it, 14, 18 feet thick?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, anybody that's been to Jerusalem has seen those stones.
SPEAKER 02 :
And they still last today even though they were torn down.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, right.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, he was a builder. And, you know, there's another principle I call yak. I like that. I got it from John Madden.
SPEAKER 02 :
I know about this one.
SPEAKER 03 :
Nehemiah would use this because it's a secret to rebuilding. You know, John Madden was an NFL coach and then color commentator on football games, NFL games. One of the best. One of the best. He coined an acronym, YAC, he called it. Yards After Contact. And it was the amount of yards that a running back, after he was hit initially the first time, how he moved forward, didn't crumble on the ground, didn't fall to the ground, how he kept moving forward toward the goal line. And from the time he was hit to where he went down, that was a new stat called yak. And this is exactly what Nehemiah did, because rebuilders deal with conflict head on. When they get hit, and we're all going to get hit, they don't just crumble or fumble the ball. They keep moving. They keep moving forward. They make some proper adjustments. They keep doing what's right. They rally their troops to greatness.
SPEAKER 02 :
I love that. YAC, Y-A-C, Yards After Contact. Every great runner keeps going when he's been hit. And he carries sometimes three or four or five people with him and sometimes across the goal line.
SPEAKER 03 :
And, you know, we're all going to face opposition. If you're not facing opposition from the devil, you're going in the same direction he is. So we're going to face opposition. And it's all a matter of how we deal with it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Our country is in the midst of conflict right now. And some people have given up. They sit down. Nehemiah did that to start with. He sat down and thought about it. But he got up and went and built a wall. And I think where we are now, we really ought to be doing some of that kind of thinking. I agree 100%.
SPEAKER 03 :
That's what the Nehemiah Code is about. It sets a pathway to us to rebuild anything. What did he eventually do? Did he finish the wall? In 52 days, the wall was completed. He finished strong. And the way he finished strong, actually, was that he stayed off the side streets by keeping focus, and he stayed off the sidelines by being faithful. And, you know, you and I both have seen people that, when they're running the last lap of life, fall on the track. Right. And I don't know about you, and I do know about you, but I know about me also. And one thing I want to do is I want to finish strong. I want to be like Nehemiah, get the job done, finish strong. God's given me a task to do, and that's exactly what I want to be about. You know, there's one of the secrets that I've found in my life. It came from a question that's actually in the Jesus Code, 52 Scripture questions every believer should answer in this code series. And it's the question that was asked in Isaiah 50. Does anyone fear the Lord anymore? Is there anyone who still fears the Lord? And you know, Dr. Dobson, if there is a forgotten subject in the church, it's the fear of God. How long has it been since you heard a sermon on the fear of God? How long has it been since you heard somebody teach on the fear of God? It's a forgotten subject. And the fear of God is not the fear that God is up there and has this big club of retribution. If we say something wrong or do something wrong, he's going to pound us over the head with it. We have to walk on eggshells. It's not the fear that God's going to put his hand on us. The fear of God is the fear that God might take his hand off of us. And if people would just live with that concept every day.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, instead of fear, I don't want to edit the Bible, but instead of fear, I think of the word awe.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, that's the word for fear in the Bible, reverential awe. In fact, in the book of Acts, it says that the early church was walking in the fear of the Lord and the comfort of the Holy Spirit, and they were multiplied. So, you know, they were walking in the fear of the Lord. They were living in this environment of the fear of the Lord that they didn't want to do anything that might cause God to take his hand of a blessing off him. All those Old Testament prophets lived in the fear of God. Noah, by fear, moved the ark, Hebrews 11 says. Moses. But he was going to the promised land. What does the Lord require of you, Deuteronomy 10? He asked him. But to fear him as you go. Joshua got the end of his life in chapter 24. His last words to his people. Now then, fear the Lord and serve him in all faithfulness. The Proverbs woman, 31. We bring her out every Mother's Day and make all the women feel guilty because they can't measure up to her. But the secret of her life is way down in verse 31. A woman who fears the Lord, she shall be praised. It's all through the Gospels.
SPEAKER 02 :
It is.
SPEAKER 03 :
Everywhere throughout Scripture. It's all through the book of Acts. It's all through the epistles. Submit yourselves one to another in the fear of the Lord, the Bible says. In fact, this is the way that we keep from sin. Proverbs 16, 6 tells us that by the fear of the Lord, one departs from evil. You know, there's a supernatural principle there that if you walk in the fear of God, he'll keep you from sin. What about Moses at Sinai when he talks about the fear of the Lord? It's all through the Bible. It'll keep us from sin. When we're walking in the fear of the Lord. God gives us a supernatural ability to overcome our sinful desires. I'll tell you something else he'll do. He'll give us supernatural wisdom to know the Word of God you're talking about a moment ago. Psalm 25, 14 says, By the secrets of the Lord are for those who fear him, and to them he'll reveal his covenants.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, I heard my dad say many times that never forget. And never doubt that the universe has a boss. Exactly. And he's not a winking, blinking grandfather who gives you everything you ask for. But he calls us to righteousness. Exactly. He calls us to stand for truth.
SPEAKER 03 :
And that same God hasn't abdicated his throne. His eyes still run to and fro over this whole world to show himself strong in behalf of those whose hearts are fixed on him.
SPEAKER 02 :
That's what worries me about our country because we have forgotten that fear, that awe. No question. And it's all through scriptures. If you read it, it'll speak to you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, no doubt about it. In fact, I would challenge your listeners that in your normal devotional time, every time you come across that concept, fear of God, circle it in your Bible, you'll be shocked. how many times it's there. And again, if our listeners today could just understand that the fear of God is not the fear God's going to put his hand of retribution on us, but the fear that he might take his hand of blessing and anointing off of us. And if we'd walk in that environment, it'd make a difference in what we do, what we say, where we go, and all those things of life. And we'd understand, as Nehemiah, that it's never too late for a new beginning.
SPEAKER 02 :
You are preaching still today in many places, aren't you?
SPEAKER 03 :
I am. In fact, I just ran into some of your friends at Scottsdale Bible the other day, and I preached at Michael Youssef's. Jay Snyder's a wonderful guy. I just was out at Church of the Apostles in Atlanta with Michael Youssef. I preach at First Baptist Dallas, my old church still, four or five times a year. Dr. Jeffers is so good to have me back. And so, yeah, but this is God has enlarged my coast. And I'd encourage people if they want to know more about all the code books or mission dignity to go to OSHawkins.com and they can get all the information.
SPEAKER 02 :
Let me remind people of what they are. You've written the Joshua Code, the Jesus Code. The James Code, the Daniel Code, the Believer's Code, the Christmas Code, and the linkage between all of those and the Nehemiah Code is taking a stand for what's right and what God has to say. Put it into your words. I'll put it into Joshua's words in Joshua 1.8.
SPEAKER 03 :
This book of the law shall not depart out of your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night in order that you may do all that is written therein, and then you'll make your way prosperous. Then you'll have good success. So these codes are just about getting us, not getting us into the Word of God, but getting the Word of God into us.
SPEAKER 02 :
You know, one of the great pleasures of what the Lord has allowed me to do here is meeting people like you who come in, and I learn from every one of you. And you have been a blessing to me today, and I know to all of our listeners. The title of the book we've been talking about is The Nehemiah Code. It's Never Too Late for a New Beginning. Dr. O.S. Hawkins. You took a lot of time to come and be here. Thank you. Let's do it again. I'd love to. Thank you so much. God bless you, friend. Thank you, brother.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, just like Nehemiah's careful work of rebuilding Jerusalem's ancient walls, we too are called to be rebuilders in our own time, whether that means repairing broken relationships, strengthening our communities, or restoring what's been lost in our culture. You've been listening to Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk. and a hope-filled conversation about rebuilding and renewal featuring Dr. Dobson and his special in-studio guest, Dr. O.S. Hawkins. Now, if you missed any portion of today's broadcast, or if you'd like to share it with a friend or loved one, visit drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. That's drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. And once you're there, you'll find the complete program, both parts one and two, along with information about Dr. O.S. Hawkins' book called The Nehemiah Code. And by the way, if you're looking for more practical ways to strengthen your family, we've partnered with the Bible app by YouVersion to bring you free, easy-to-use reading plans that fit your busy schedule. Each plan offers Dr. Dobson's trusted insights on marriage, parenting, and family life delivered right to your phone or tablet. Ready to get started? Well, simply open the Bible app and then search for Dr. James Dobson or JDFI, more family talk, and discover resources that can transform your family one day at a time. Well, I'm Roger Marsh, and from all of us here at Family Talk, thanks so much for listening. Be sure to join us again next time right here for another edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Join Dr. James Dobson on this enlightening episode of Family Talk as he engages with Dr. O.S. Hawkins, a renowned figure in Christian ministry. Discover the remarkable journey of Dr. Hawkins from being a senior pastor to leading Guidestone Financial Resources, where his Mission Dignity program brings hope to retired pastors and their widows. The discussion revolves around the transformative power of faith, drawing wisdom from the biblical story of Nehemiah and how it can inspire us to rebuild important aspects of our lives.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome everyone to Family Talk. It's a ministry of the James Dobson Family Institute supported by listeners just like you. I'm Dr. James Dobson and I'm thrilled that you've joined us.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, welcome to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Roger Marsh, and today we're joined by a beloved voice in Christian ministry, Dr. O.S. Hawkins, former senior pastor of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas. After many, many years in the pulpit, Dr. Hawkins followed God's call to lead Guidestone Financial Resources, where he has helped transform the lives of retired pastors and their widows through their Mission Dignity program. Dr. Now, you may know Dr. Hawkins from his popular Code series of devotional books, including The Joshua Code, The Jesus Code, and our topic for today, The Nehemiah Code. In today's conversation with Dr. Dobson, Dr. Hawkins will share an encouraging word about new beginnings, drawing wisdom from the biblical story of Nehemiah. Whether you're looking to rebuild relationships or start fresh in any other area of your life, you will not want to miss what these two doctors have to say on this most important topic. Let's get into this conversation right now on today's edition of Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk.
SPEAKER 03 :
Doctor? We are so pleased and honored to have a man here that many of you will recognize because his name is very well known in Christendom. He is Dr. O.S. Hawkins, who for years was the head pastor of of the historic First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, where Dr. W.A. Criswell was the beloved pastor for 50 years. I love that church. I've spoken there. Of course, Dr. Robert Jeffress is the senior pastor now, but Dr. Hawkins holds a doctorate of ministry from Luther Rice Seminary, and he's working on a PhD now at Southwestern Seminary, which will make him the oldest earner of a Ph.D. in the history of the school. Is that right? I think that's pretty close. And you're about to work on your dissertation. I am. Well, you're a Texan. I'm a Texan. We had dinner together, and I found out I really like you. I mean to tell you, I would like to be your friend for the rest of my life, and it would be just a pleasure to have you here again because you have the same values and the same beliefs that I do, and we have walked a similar path. And it's a pleasure to have you here. You flew here to be with us today. And God is blessing your life, isn't he?
SPEAKER 02 :
He is. And let me just say, for my wife Susie and myself, in the library of people we've always loved and respected, you and Shirley are way up there on the top shelf, because we couldn't have raised our girls back in the 70s and the 80s without Dare to Discipline, without Hide or Seek, and especially without The Strong-Willed Child. Susie told me today that she got that book out and looked at it again, and It's tear-stained all the way through it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you've got to bring her here the next time you come. I shall. You have two daughters.
SPEAKER 02 :
We have two daughters. And they're grown. Wendy and Holly. Wendy is an attorney. She and her husband are both attorneys in Dallas. They have two children. And then Holly, our youngest, is an author with Thomas Nelson with Children's Devotionals. And she's married to a young man who's one of the ministers at Prestonwood Baptist Church in Dallas.
SPEAKER 03 :
And they have four children. That's Dr. Jack Graham's church. It is. I've been there, too. I have in front of me a copy of the cover of Holly's book, I Can Learn the Bible. Gave a plug to that book some years ago, and I hope that it hasn't disappeared.
SPEAKER 02 :
No, you did, and she is greatly appreciated. She has that, and then she also has the children's devotional called I Can Learn to Pray, and they're incredible books for teaching our kids. You know, as parents, we want to teach our kids to learn the Bible. We want to teach them to pray. Sometimes we don't know how, and these are books that just help hold hands with parents and help them really know how they can lead their kids to do that.
SPEAKER 03 :
those things well you are no longer a pastor but you're working in a church context and in a way that is extremely helpful primarily to widows but to pastors and others who are having difficulty financially but describe for me what your application of the ministry is now
SPEAKER 02 :
In 1997, I left the pastor of the First Baptist Church in Dallas, where I love those people to this day and have such great memories of my days and years there. I left there to become president of Guidestone Financial Resources. It is a Christian evangelical mutual fund that serves 250,000 different participants over 300 years. Christian universities, 40,000 churches with all kinds of financial service needs. We're the world's largest Christian screen mutual fund. You just slurred past that, but say that again. Guidestone is the world's largest Christian screen mutual fund, $16 billion under assets right now. And we just received a few years ago from Lipper and Morningstar in New York, the number one mutual fund. in the country beating out 242 other mutual funds with assets of $40 billion and below. And so we're proving that you can keep your Christian values and still not sacrifice excellence in the investment arena.
SPEAKER 03 :
So our Guidestone Funds— That means you don't invest in any known association with—
SPEAKER 02 :
Our investment policy is that we don't invest in companies that are publicly recognized to be involved in alcohol, gambling, tobacco, abortion, pornography, or any other issues like that that are abhorrent to our Christian values.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now, you call this a ministry, and there's a reason for it. I alluded to it earlier explained.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. It's a ministry because we serve these pastors and churches. You know, our goal is to get a couple of these generations on our watch to vocational retirement with enough financial security that they don't have to be on somebody else's relief roll, that they can have enough financial security, they can volunteer for ministry and missions all over the world, because we also serve a lot of folks who don't have that privilege. We have a ministry called Mission Dignity. Dr. Dobson, we're on a mission to bring dignity to some forgotten folks, and that's retired pastors, and in most cases now, they're widows. Average age is about 85 in our program, living at the poverty level. These are folks who pastored out in the crossroads of life in seemingly forgotten places, lived in a church-owned home all their ministry, never made enough to get by much less.
SPEAKER 03 :
Many of them didn't even get Social Security because the church couldn't pay for it.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. And they couldn't get by because they had no money to prepare for retirement. They were just trying to live from week to week and paycheck to paycheck. And so we come alongside them in their declining years. Ten years ago, we raised enough money to give them, I'm talking about thousands of people in this program, to give them $50 a month extra. But we've raised so much money recently, that the neediest among them now get $630 a month. One little pastor's widow, 87 years old, wrote me recently and said, I get to eat at night now, and it's not just a piece of toast. Isn't that unbelievable? Yeah. So to be Christ-hand extended to these people, it's close to the heart of God. In the book of James, the Bible tells us that pure and undefiled religion is this, to take care of widows. And that's all through the Scriptures. It's woven throughout the Scriptures, and it's our privilege to be Christ's hand extended. The beautiful thing about this program... is that we have endowed years ago all the expenses of the program. So everybody that works in the bookkeeping of it, everybody that works in the development program, all their salaries are paid out of this endowment. All the printed materials that we provide for the people, even the stamp that goes on the check to thousands of these people each month is paid for out of that endowment so that everyone who gives to Mission Dignity knows that every single penny they give goes to them. And we've raised $150 million. Wow. in the last 10 or 15 years for this. And all the royalties to my books, we have a code series of devotional books with Thomas Nelson.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we're going to talk about that today.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, they've sold over a million and a half copies in the last three or four years. And the reason I can talk about that is because all the royalties to all those books also go to these precious people in mission. You know, there's a baby boomer generation that's coming into retirement, and they're not prepared for retirement. And they're getting a double whammy. Some of them still have... aged parents that they're trying to take care of. And at the same time, they've got kids that are 30 or 40 years old that many of them are still providing for. So we've got a whole situation with mission dignity where we continue to grow it because of the growing need that's there. I would like everybody to remember that name. Say it again. Mission Dignity. Yeah, you can go to OSHawkins.com and click. There's a page there. You can click on Mission Dignity. Just listen to a few of the videos of these people and learn more about the program there.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I'm glad we had a chance to talk about that. We're actually here to talk about your book. And you mentioned that you have written a number of books. And the linkage to them all is the word CODE, C-O-D-E. And those books are? The Joshua Code, the Jesus Code, the James Code, the Daniel Code, the Believer's Code, the Christmas Code, and the Easter Code, and the one we're going to talk about today, the Nehemiah Code. What is the linkage between all this?
SPEAKER 02 :
I believe that there are nuggets of truth in Scripture, in these books of the Bible, that really, when they're mine, can give us a code to live on and to live by. And so these are all devotional books. And the secret to them, Dr. Dobson, is in the subtitle. For example, the first one is the Joshua Code. And the subtitle is 52 Scripture Verses. every believer should know. So it's a devotional book for a year where you take one verse of Scripture, memorize it that week. You know, Scripture memories are a lost art in Christian living. Memorize that verse that week. There are devotional helps on it there through it. And it's a year-long devotion. It comes from Joshua 1.8 that says, shall not depart out of your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night in order to do all that is written therein. Then you'll make your way prosperous. Then you'll have good success. So what I found was that there were a lot of people who wanted to get into the Word of God. They just didn't know where to start. They start in the book of Genesis, and by the time they get to Leviticus, they're bogged down. Or if they start in the New Testament, they get to Matthew, and they can't pronounce four-fifths of the names in the genealogy in Matthew 1. So I picked out 52 verses in the Bible. If you know these verses, you're going to know the message of the Bible. And if you know these verses, there are 52 verses I believe every believer should know before they go to heaven. And it had such success, it sold several hundred thousand copies, that we followed it up with the Jesus Code. Do you know, one of the things, I was reading through the Gospels just devotionally, and I was astounded by something interesting. I'd seen a hundred times before, but never really seen, if you know what I mean. And that was the numbers of times Jesus asked questions in the Scripture. He was always asking questions. Now, He didn't need answers. He was omniscient. He knew everything. But 150 questions are recorded in the Gospels that escape the lips of our Lord. It dawned on me that there are 52 Scripture questions every believer ought to answer before they go to heaven. And so we wrote the Jesus Code. Again, it's a devotional book, take you through a year, with 52 questions. If a man dies, shall he live again? All these questions in the Bible, most of them from the lips of Jesus. Who do you say that I am? That people ought to know before they get to heaven. And then we followed that up with the James Code of Practical Principles for Christian Living, the Daniel Code, how to really live in this culture, Daniel Code. was taken out of a culture that he lived in. And much like many of us, we're living in a new culture around us today and how he thrived in it. Then we have the Believer's Code, which is a 365-day devotional. And what's really taken off is the Christmas Code. And the Christmas Code is an Advent devotional, 25 sermons from December 1 to 25. And in the back of it is the plan of salvation, plainly experienced, where somebody could put their faith and trust in Christ. And it's a little paperback. There's a church in Syracuse, New York, wrote me, and they bought 9,000 of them and put them on every door ever. in a certain mile radius of their church with an invitation to their Christmas Eve service. That church runs about 800 or 900 in worship. 1,900 people showed up to their Christmas Eve service, and hundreds of people came to know.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, you left the pastorate for another assignment, and yet you're probably preaching, quote-unquote, to more people now than you were then.
SPEAKER 02 :
In the pulpit. I preach almost every Sunday in the pulpit somewhere around the country. But through the printed page, God has just enlarged my coast and my sphere of influence. You know, there's an incredible verse of Scripture in 2 Corinthians 10-13. It says that God has assigned to us an area of influence. Now think about that. Somewhere there's somebody that every one of us can reach like no one else can because God has assigned an area of influence. Now you were a track star in high school. Oh, no. Well, you ran track with Bobby Morrow, the Olympic champion. That's him. Okay. But you ran track. Okay. So when the Corinthians were reading this and they saw that, they would have immediately jumped to their feet when they saw that Greek word Paul used to say that God has assigned an area of influence. It's the same Greek word that they would use in those Grecian games or we would use in track meets to describe a lane in which you're to run. When you run a relay race or you run in a track meet, you're assigned a lane and you can't get out of that. If you get out of that lane, you're disqualified and you have to run that race in that lane. And that's the word Paul used to say that God has assigned to every one of us a an area of influence. And so I want to just say this about you. You know, the word influence comes from two Latin words, in and flow. And the word picture is of this mighty river that's flowing vibrant and crystal clear and with a deep current, and into it run these little tributaries and streams and creeks that flow into it and are carried away in its flow. And that's where we get our word influence. And so I'm thankful to be here today because I'm one of those people of the millions that got caught up in Jim Dobson's flow. in that area of influence God assigned to you.
SPEAKER 03 :
That brings tears to my eyes because the truth of the matter is I can't take the credit for it. The Lord was doing something, and it was a shock to me all the way along as to what was happening. And the fact that he could use me, you know, Shirley and I were just college kids that got married and we really didn't know where the Lord was taking us. Although I was headed for graduate school, I knew what I wanted to do there. But it's just been amazing how doors have opened. And whenever I've gotten to a barrier, it has moved. And I couldn't do that. There's nothing I could do. And so it's almost scary to me to take the credit for what's taking place.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, the last chapter in the new Nehemiah Code that we're going to talk about in a moment is about finishing strong. And if anybody's ever finished strong, you and Shirley certainly are finishing strong. And, you know, going back to influence. In fact, I wrote a book that all the royalties also go to mission dignity called VIP. You know, that acronym. We couldn't exist in our vocabulary in English if we didn't use acronyms. I mean, we were talking about education a while ago. If you want to go to college to earn a BA, you better have a good GPA and you better score well on the SAT or you're not going to get a BA and then can't get an MA. You know, we're being protected by the CIA and the FBI right now. Now, April 15th, the IRS is going to come knocking on my door. I'm cancer-free today because of a test called PSA test. I use the ESV because I think the NIV is a little too eclectic. We live by acronyms, and no acronym has muscled and maneuvered its way into English vernacular more than that one, VIP. Very important person, because being important is the life goal of a lot of people. But I've changed that acronym because I think it's supposed to mean VIP. very influential person. You know, the world has a way of forgetting those people that deem themselves important, but we have a long memory when it comes to those who've influenced our lives. And so VIP, and I want to say this about you before you cut me off, because if you're going to be a person of influence, a VIP, those are the three things that are vital. V is for vision. People who influence others know where they're going. People don't follow people that don't know where they're going. I Somebody says, well, that ought to be intellect because knowledge is power. Somebody says it ought to be intensity and passion. No, it's for integrity. I've known a lot of people with a lot of great intellect had no integrity and aren't in the race anymore. And P is for purpose. They don't just know where they are going and who they are. They know why they're here. And Jim, the one thing about you is this. You've lived your life knowing where you were going, who you were, and why you're here. And because of that, God has enlarged the scope of your ministry, and even to this very day. My goodness.
SPEAKER 03 :
Again, that's very touching to me, and the Lord's blessed you in the same way, and continues to do so.
SPEAKER 02 :
I'm simply saying what millions of people would say if they were sitting in the microphone, having the opportunity to say thank you.
SPEAKER 03 :
I heard you speak at the Ruth Shanahan's funeral. This was, what, two years ago?
SPEAKER 02 :
Two years ago.
SPEAKER 03 :
And was very impressed by what you had to say there. She was a great lady, wasn't she?
SPEAKER 02 :
She was a wonderful lady. Came from a wonderful lady by the name of Mary Crowley, her mom. And I just got through preaching her brother, Don Carter's funeral here the other day. But Ruth Shanahan's one of the greatest women I know. And she loved two organizations. She loved three organizations. She loved our First Baptist Church in Dallas. She loved the Billy Graham Association, and she loved Jim and Shirley Dobson. And she gave her life to those organizations and her money to those organizations.
SPEAKER 03 :
She helped support Shirley's work in the National Day of Prayer as well as ours. So I love her for a bunch of reasons. Your book, again, is called The Nehemiah Code, but the subtitle is very important. It's never too late for a new beginning. A new beginning reminds me of Ronald Reagan, because when he was inaugurated all over town, there were these billboards and signs saying, A New Beginning. And we had one. And we did have one. And this book really comes back to that phrase in many of the illustrations and points that you make.
SPEAKER 02 :
And you know, no matter who we are, what we've done, where we live— It's never too late for a new beginning. You know, there are a lot of people needing a new beginning. There are people who've lost their self-confidence looking for a new beginning. People have been divorced and they're trying to start over. They need a new beginning. People have lost a spouse. It opens the page of a new chapter, a new beginning in their lives. Churches are looking to reach revitalized new beginning. Businesses are needing a new beginning. Coaches are rebuilding teams. Rebuilding process is something that touches every single one of us. And while many people just look at Nehemiah for the leadership principles that are there, what I believe the book is really about is the fact that it's never too late to rebuild our lives. It's never too late to rebuild the broken walls and the burned gates of our lives and have a second chance.
SPEAKER 03 :
That new beginning often involves repentance and reconciliation and forgiveness, doesn't it? You start there. I mean, none of us is perfect. We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. And he can take whatever mess you've made out of your life and make it new.
SPEAKER 02 :
You're in the middle of the bullseye because broken relationships, for example. There's an offending party and there's an offended party. In most cases, there's a little bit of both of us in all of them that get broken. But by and large, there's an offending party and an offended party. So two things have to happen for a new beginning. There must be, as you just said, a spirit of repentance on the part of the offending party. But there also has to be a spirit of reception on the heart of the offended party. And as a pastor for decades, one of the things I found in dealing with people's lives and broken relationships was often it was more the folks that just couldn't bring themselves to accept the fact the person had repented and received them back than it was the people that didn't repent to mend the broken relationship. So those two things are vital in doing that for sure. And forgiveness is the key.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we have just barely started the conversation about the Nehemiah Code, and the time is gone. You've flown here. Will you stay long enough to do another program with us? In a drop-dead, heartbeat minute. Well, we've got a lot to talk about here, and I can't wait to get into it. Great. I appreciate you. I appreciate your kind words to me, but they rebound from me to you immediately. And the life you've lived, you've lived a life of integrity and purpose. And thank you for being true to the gospel and to the one that we love, Jesus Christ. And he's continuing to bless you. Let's leave it there and pick it up next time. Wonderful. Wonderful.
SPEAKER 01 :
Well, you've been listening to Family Talk and an inspiring conversation featuring our own Dr. James Dobson and his guest, Dr. OS Hawkins, about finding new beginnings through God's grace. These powerful insights remind us that it's never too late to rebuild, whether it's in a relationship, our faith, or our purpose in life. Now, if you missed any part of today's broadcast or if you'd just like to share it with someone who needs this message of hope, go to drjamesdobson.org forward slash family talk. And keep in mind, you can also access this program on the JDFI app as well. Well, today's program about hope and new beginnings and others like it are made possible through the generous support of friends just like you. If today's conversation about God's transforming power has touched your heart, would you consider partnering with us? Your tax-deductible donation of any amount helps us continue broadcasting biblical truth to families all across America and all over the world. You can make a secure donation online when you go to drjamesdobson.org. That's drjamesdobson.org. Or give us a call at 877-732-6825. And before we leave for today, I want to remind you about a helpful way to receive daily encouragement from Family Talk, and that's by signing up for our free reading plans on the Bible app by YouVersion. Whether you're waiting in the carpool or taking a quiet moment before bedtime, these brief devotionals offer practical wisdom for your family journey, featuring topics like a mother's impact on her children, Now, the plans are designed to fit your busy schedule while helping you build a stronger family on God's foundation. To access these free reading plans, simply open the Bible app on your phone or tablet and search for JDFI, the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. These bite-sized devotionals might be just what you need to bring fresh biblical perspective to your daily routine. I'm Roger Marsh, inviting you to join us again next time for part two of Dr. Dobson's powerful discussion with Dr. O.S. Hawkins. That's coming your way next time right here on Dr. James Dobson's Family Talk, the voice you trust for the family you love. This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
